Views on 183's (complaints)

I'm curious about something. I'd like to know how deputies (not supervisors) feel about how 183's are handled. For those who've been lucky enough to avoid them so far, a 183 is a complaint lodged against an S.O. employee. These are usually citizen complaints against deputies.
For those who have been through them, I'd like your views on them.

How do you feel about the procedure itself?
How do you feel about the length of time it took, from the filing of the complaint, to learning the final results?
Do you feel that the time was reasonable, or excessive?
Did the wait effect your frame of mind while you were working?
What were your feelings during the wait to find out if, and how much, trouble you were in?
Were you relaxed, and confident that you'd be treated fairly, or were you stressed, and fearful of punishment?
Do you believe that your work product was as strong during this wait as it would be normally?
Do you approve of the philosophy that EVERY complaint, including frivilous and anonymous complaints are treated with equal validity?
During the investigation, did you feel that you were put in the position of having to defend yourself, or did you feel that supervision "had your back"?
Supervision claims that this procedure is done so to "protect you", so your rights are not violated.
Did you feel "protected" during your investigation?
And lastly, do you believe these investigations can be conducted just as thoroughly, and protect your rights just as completely, if they were done in a more timely manner, with a more humane procedure that looks out for you as well as the complainant?

These are not trick questions, or trap questions. Since the introduction of these 183 procedures, a lot of us have had to endure them. I adamantly disagree with the way they are handled, and wonder if I am the only one who feels "victimized" but them. I don't feel that my supervision is "protecting my rights". I believe they are following a strict procedure, so when they take action against a deputy, they can say that they "did it the right way". I see nothing humane in the way we are treated by this procedure, and believe it needs to be changed. We can be professional, righteous, and thorough without putting deputies through the ringer every time one of these complaints is made. I also see a great deal of time wasted on these (the average 183 takes 1 1/2-3 months to complete) investigations, with minimal input from the accused deputies.

I find it shocking that supervision follows these procedures, without questioning if a better way can be found. The procedure is flawed, and it mistreats the accused. Right does not always take care of right, and the overuse of 183's is a prime example of that. This is a good agency. I am not a proponent of unions, but I predict unionization if these sorts of actions aren't examined and changed. Just my opinion. If you disagree, speak out. Thanks for giving me your time.
Be safe.

What?! Nobody has a home PC?!!

OK, I'll be the brave one. I think there's alot wrong with the way 183's are handled. I had one 1 few months ago. I was cleared on it, but the wait was hell! I wasn't asked for my side of the story for nearly 2 weeks! By then, I figured they built a pretty good case against me. I wasn't cleared by any effort on the supervisors part. I had a witness!

If they want to protect our rights, why not just give us our rights up front, then find out what we have to say? And why did it take a month to investigate a complaint where a citizen wasn't happy because I arrested her son? Was I relaxed, and able to perform my duties OK during that time? What do you think? No. I think way too much time is wasted on all the 183's that come through the S.O. Should we investigate complaints? Yes. But we investigation too many BS complaints, and they do take too long. I wonder how the public feels about their taz money being wasted on a month long investigation about a legal arrest. Oh, the kid was convicted, by the way. SAO didn't see anything wrong with it.

I agree, this is a great agency. But when things need to change, they need to change.

Citizen complaints are handled in their present fashion because of CALEA guidelines. Supervisors(Sergeants and Lieutenants) have no say in the matter. I can assure you that no supervisor wants to take the time out of their daily duties and responsibilities to conduct some administrative complaint on a deputy. Line supervisors are required to have these investigations complete within 5 days, only those going to A.I. are given longer due dates (up to 90 days).

No one likes to have to defend their actions, but if you have done nothing wrong you should not be concerned. If in fact your investigation took the length of time you say it did then I would tend to believe the allegations were serious enough that it should have be handled in A.I. not by a supervisor.[/u]

Well, the timing of this seems right on the money! I guess I'm not the only one who sees problems with this procedure. I can't really say a lot yet, because I currently have a grievance against this particular procedure. But I will say that my complaint isn't with supervision...well, not completely. Granted, the investigation was not properly conducted, and I have aggrieved that. But I believe the procedure to be far from perfect. I realize that supervision is only following the CALEA guidelines for how this is done. However, why can't that procedure be changed? When there is a better way of doing things, why can't WE adapt. There is no reasonable explanation for blindly following a process, when that process is faulty.

I agree with "Guest". Give me my Rights up front. Allow me to document my side of things, while my memory is fresh. If you develope additional questions through your investigation, then come back and ask me about it. If you feel that I have to be given my Rights again, then do it. What would it hurt? It's much more deputy friendly than making me sweat it out for weeks, before I know what is happening.

As for my own case, I can tell you that the time line wasn't adhered to...and the case was not sent to AI for investigation. The complaint was made against me on September 16th. I was asked to do a memo on October 4th, and the case was closed by the supervisor on October 24th. I wasn't notified of the findings until November 7th. So that shoots a hole in that 5-day investigation theory. To allow an employee to go that long without knowing their fate, is just cold and uncaring. I don't know about the complaints of others, but I do know that this seems to be common practice. And given this topic thread, I see that I'm not the only one who is bothered by this procedure.

After my grievance is handled, I may be able to speak more freely about the matter. It would be nice, as I'm pretty disturbed about the incompetent handling of the 183 that was done. But for now, I'll wait to see how the chain of command deals with the issue. I do not judge all supervisors by the ineptness of one. I'm going to trust that the obvious errors will be corrected, and we can all move on and get back to work.

To answer the "Guest's" questions, no, I do not feel that the current procedure "has my back", or is deputy friendly. I believe the procedure should and can change to benefit the deputy, without swaying the outcome of the investigation in the deputies favor. When the deputy is in the right, then right should show itself. In my case, it did not. So I am fighting that. A change in the process might just help us all avoid this in the future. As "Guest" also said, right doesn't always take care of right. I used to believe it did, but I've learned differently. When a supervisor is biased, the deputy is on their own. Thank goodness we work for an agency that allows us to have a grievance process for just such situations. And thank goodness I had witnesses in my particular case. This way it's not just my word verses his. In that scenario, I know which way the hammer would swing.

[NotsoOld Cop]

I'm just posting this to say that the last post was from me. It posted under "Guest" for some reason. I'm not sure why. Anyway, I believe in honesty. When you are honest, and try to change things for the better, then you shouldn't have to fear retaliation, right? We'll see what happens.
Be safe all.

[lr5890]

All I can say in response to that ? is that having been through one and it ending my career...I beleive 100% that the agency/supervisors did not have my back in it. It was a BS citizen complaint which i proved to be untrue in my interview then somehow the evidence i submitted "DISAPPEARED" and nobody ever seen it. Funny how that happened! I resigned due to the BS that continued over a 2-3 month period of time. Not the investigation itself. Not to mention I was notified of an investigation 5 months after the incident actually occurred....guess stopping by a friends house while on duty,10-8 not 51 to a call and inside your sector is now a violation of multiple g.o.'s not to mention apparently while outside of your agency issued vehicle you can no longer "monitor the radio" (guess we werent issued portable radios in the end of 2007) these are just a couple things I was accused of doing or not doing for that matter. Oh and just to clear things up....NO I NEVER HAD ANY AFFAIR WITH A FREAKIN SUPERVISOR....! If anyone needs to know something about me or what goes on in my personal life...ask me...! All I can say is every LEO out there should make sure they get a degree in something other than Law enforcement to have something to fall back on because the "FAMILY" line is a load of SHIT! The only truth they have said at all is they will stand behind you...while stabbing you in the back! Good luck and be safe!

[lr5890]

All I can say in response to that ? is that having been through one and it ending my career...I beleive 100% that the agency/supervisors did not have my back in it. It was a BS citizen complaint which i proved to be untrue in my interview then somehow the evidence i submitted "DISAPPEARED" and nobody ever seen it. Funny how that happened! I resigned due to the BS that continued over a 2-3 month period of time. Not the investigation itself. Not to mention I was notified of an investigation 5 months after the incident actually occurred....guess stopping by a friends house while on duty,10-8 not 51 to a call and inside your sector is now a violation of multiple g.o.'s not to mention apparently while outside of your agency issued vehicle you can no longer "monitor the radio" (guess we werent issued portable radios in the end of 2007) these are just a couple things I was accused of doing or not doing for that matter. Oh and just to clear things up....NO I NEVER HAD ANY AFFAIR WITH A FREAKIN SUPERVISOR....! If anyone needs to know something about me or what goes on in my personal life...ask me...! All I can say is every LEO out there should make sure they get a degree in something other than Law enforcement to have something to fall back on because the "FAMILY" line is a load of SHIT! The only truth they have said at all is they will stand behind you...while stabbing you in the back! Good luck and be safe!

It disgusts me that the lowliest cranker on Wabash is innocent until proven guilty....but if you are accused of anything as a deputy you are GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT....the system is flawed..it is a stressful, life altering ordeal, no matter how stupid or meaningless the complain...and make no mistake about it people...they keep track...so as a CAPTAIN once told me...even if they are unfounded or unsustained if you get enough of those they effect you...so there for they encourage you to be lazy, not be confrontational, appease the dopers and thieves of the world .... as long as u dont get a complaint...u r ok


I'm curious about something. I'd like to know how deputies (not supervisors) feel about how 183's are handled. For those who've been lucky enough to avoid them so far, a 183 is a complaint lodged against an S.O. employee. These are usually citizen complaints against deputies.
For those who have been through them, I'd like your views on them.

How do you feel about the procedure itself?
How do you feel about the length of time it took, from the filing of the complaint, to learning the final results?
Do you feel that the time was reasonable, or excessive?
Did the wait effect your frame of mind while you were working?
What were your feelings during the wait to find out if, and how much, trouble you were in?
Were you relaxed, and confident that you'd be treated fairly, or were you stressed, and fearful of punishment?
Do you believe that your work product was as strong during this wait as it would be normally?
Do you approve of the philosophy that EVERY complaint, including frivilous and anonymous complaints are treated with equal validity?
During the investigation, did you feel that you were put in the position of having to defend yourself, or did you feel that supervision "had your back"?
Supervision claims that this procedure is done so to "protect you", so your rights are not violated.
Did you feel "protected" during your investigation?
And lastly, do you believe these investigations can be conducted just as thoroughly, and protect your rights just as completely, if they were done in a more timely manner, with a more humane procedure that looks out for you as well as the complainant?

These are not trick questions, or trap questions. Since the introduction of these 183 procedures, a lot of us have had to endure them. I adamantly disagree with the way they are handled, and wonder if I am the only one who feels "victimized" but them. I don't feel that my supervision is "protecting my rights". I believe they are following a strict procedure, so when they take action against a deputy, they can say that they "did it the right way". I see nothing humane in the way we are treated by this procedure, and believe it needs to be changed. We can be professional, righteous, and thorough without putting deputies through the ringer every time one of these complaints is made. I also see a great deal of time wasted on these (the average 183 takes 1 1/2-3 months to complete) investigations, with minimal input from the accused deputies.

I find it shocking that supervision follows these procedures, without questioning if a better way can be found. The procedure is flawed, and it mistreats the accused. Right does not always take care of right, and the overuse of 183's is a prime example of that. This is a good agency. I am not a proponent of unions, but I predict unionization if these sorts of actions aren't examined and changed. Just my opinion. If you disagree, speak out. Thanks for giving me your time.
Be safe.

[lr5890]

It's funny you say it that way...I once had a SGT. tell me "If you are not getting complained on then you are not doing your job" after receiving a stupid bs complaint from a citizen that i was harrassing her brother who was a known drug dealer, by pulling him over every time i seen him. So guess it depends on who your supervision is.

The Sheriff says that same thing "if you're not getting complained on ect" at just about every promotion ceremony yet the brass are the first people to slam a deputy for doing the same thing they did on a regualr basis when they were a deputies. I know times have changed and but the question i have is this? when people come in and lodge complaints, they sign a paper saying that if they are found to have filed a false report they COULD be arrrested. just out of curiosity Sheriff/AI how many of these lying dopers have you actually arrested? I cant remember the last time i read in the newspaper that so & so was arrested for filing a false report against a deputy. you say you stand behind your deputies, why dont you start actually doing it or is a vote more important that a hard working deputy? yes you may give your people the tools to go out and do the job, but they are the ones girnding it out on the streets and producing the top stories you take credit for. Sheriff there is no doubt that you have done wonders for your agency but there is more to the game than your picture on tv. try showing the world, by example, that you back your people 100%.

[lr5890]

AMEN!!! can't really say much more about it than that...lol It was really disappointing to myself and quite a few others I must say how much I loved my job and what I was doing and to have false allegations by a "citizen" (with no reprocussions) take it all away and prevent me from continuing my career doing what I loved most and dedicated my life and studies to do. I'm sure i'm not the only one out there that had it ripped away after working so hard to get it to now be left with nothing and no hope as it seems of ever being again.

lr5890:

Hit me up at this email, We NEED to talk...

newport069@hotmail.com

Maybe we can 56 so we can have a chat... Need some advise... thnx

My biggest complaint with thel investigation of complaints from citizens is the procedure of taking the complaint. I was also told that per CALEA all complaints have to be investigated. Okay, but the person making the complaint should be required to make a sworn statement of some sort, whether written or recorded, so when it turns out to be bogus crap there is some legal repercussion available to the deputy. Give me fair consideration in the investigation process. Years ago a sworn statement was required and it cut out about 75 percent of the bull.