overcrowding in PCJ

the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

[quote="wfla just did a story on":3ilkkywt]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?[/quote:3ilkkywt]

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.

To the previous reply, YOU the PO, first has to have evidence that the violation is willful and substantial prior to completing the violation. That's why it's called a Probable Cause Affidavit. It's morons like you who do not know what your job responsibilities are that makes it harder on other PO's. PO's are not to violate for any reason unless you can prove the violation, then the Judge decides. Like those PO's who were violating for having porno when a shopping catalog was the evidence. That shows stupidity.

CSC IN REGION 1 DO NOT GIVE US THAT OPTION. CAs ARE SO PETRIFIED OVER GETTING FIRED THEY CANNOT THINK ON THEIR OWN.

The news media makes all our problems. The news forced DOC into a Zero Tolerence and now they are talking about overcrowding at PCJ.

To the previous reply, YOU the PO, first has to have evidence that the violation is willful and substantial prior to completing the violation. That's why it's called a Probable Cause Affidavit. It's morons like you who do not know what your job responsibilities are that makes it harder on other PO's. PO's are not to violate for any reason unless you can prove the violation, then the Judge decides. Like those PO's who were violating for having porno when a shopping catalog was the evidence. That shows stupidity.

You are the idiot moron - every place I know stopped letting us do technicals for failure to pay restitution etc. We send a VOP to the Judge with circumstances and he decides what to do, which sometimes is issue a warrant even though at court he might ultimately reduce the money due to a civil lien. I have even seen some judges issue no bond warrants on this - some say it is due o them not reading it well. They would never do that would they?

[quote="wfla just did a story on":1ajn6859]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.[/quote:1ajn6859]

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on!

[quote=Anonymous][quote="wfla just did a story on":2h4fs6x4]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.[/quote:2h4fs6x4]

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on![/quote:2h4fs6x4]

Appeals courts have already ruled on ability to pay but that doesnt stop the unlucky one from sitting in there for a month or so if the judge initially thinks he could have paid or didnt read the circumstances good enough I guess.

[quote=Anonymous][quote="wfla just did a story on":3r9756gk]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on![/quote:3r9756gk]

Appeals courts have already ruled on ability to pay but that doesnt stop the unlucky one from sitting in there for a month or so if the judge initially thinks he could have paid or didnt read the circumstances good enough I guess.[/quote:3r9756gk]

and you persist in making my point for me! if you place someone in jail even for 1 sec for non payment of funds! that is debtor's prison and illegal in this country! there is no exception!

[quote="worried citizen":os7tz767][quote=Anonymous][quote="wfla just did a story on":os7tz767]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on![/quote:os7tz767]

Appeals courts have already ruled on ability to pay but that doesnt stop the unlucky one from sitting in there for a month or so if the judge initially thinks he could have paid or didnt read the circumstances good enough I guess.[/quote:os7tz767]

and you persist in making my point for me! if you place someone in jail even for 1 sec for non payment of funds! that is debtor's prison and illegal in this country! there is no exception![/quote:os7tz767]

Judges are immune to lawsuits basically - sorry.....

Time is needed for the determination by a Judge..... 8)

It is time for offender's and some sharp attorneys to start filing lawsuits against PO's who willfully ignore the law (including case law) when they do VOP'S they know full well are bogus- Like not paying COPS when you don't have the funds. Or can't find a suitable place to live when you are a sex offender.

IF you were not asleep in your legal liabilities class you should remember you are only safe if you are acting under the color of the law and following statutes, case law and written procedures otherwise some dirtbag is going to be living in your house.

Quoth the raven, "public safety"

It is time for offender's and some sharp attorneys to start filing lawsuits against PO's who willfully ignore the law (including case law) when they do VOP'S they know full well are bogus- Like not paying COPS when you don't have the funds. Or can't find a suitable place to live when you are a sex offender.

IF you were not asleep in your legal liabilities class you should remember you are only safe if you are acting under the color of the law and following statutes, case law and written procedures otherwise some dirtbag is going to be living in your house.

Quoth the raven, "public safety"

:lol: Zero tolerance - we report to the judge with circumstances and he makes the decision to issue a warrant or not, not the PO. Also if you have an F3 lets say where you got 2 years probation the judge can give you another 3 years probation on it even if you couldnt pay the 85,000 restitution in 2 years due to living expenses and this person had a good lawyer at his VOP hearing. The judge just said he was extending it to 5 years for the probationer to pay more restitution because he thought the person wouldnt pay any more if reduced to a civil lien and the lawyer put in an appeal on it, but nothing changed....

[quote="worried citizen":22qnpja8][quote=Anonymous][quote="wfla just did a story on":22qnpja8]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on!

Appeals courts have already ruled on ability to pay but that doesnt stop the unlucky one from sitting in there for a month or so if the judge initially thinks he could have paid or didnt read the circumstances good enough I guess.[/quote:22qnpja8]

and you persist in making my point for me! if you place someone in jail even for 1 sec for non payment of funds! that is debtor's prison and illegal in this country! there is no exception![/quote:22qnpja8]

Judges are immune to lawsuits basically - sorry.....

Time is needed for the determination by a Judge..... 8)[/quote:22qnpja8]



"time is needed for the determination by a Judge" what determination....that was done a century ago by us supreme court when it outlawed debtor's prison's! unless they have changed their minds there is no determination needed! if you are locking someone up for nonpayment of anything you are violating the law! judge or not!

[quote=Anonymous][quote="worried citizen":x3p61x4m][quote=Anonymous][quote="wfla just did a story on":x3p61x4m]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on!

Appeals courts have already ruled on ability to pay but that doesnt stop the unlucky one from sitting in there for a month or so if the judge initially thinks he could have paid or didnt read the circumstances good enough I guess.[/quote:x3p61x4m]

and you persist in making my point for me! if you place someone in jail even for 1 sec for non payment of funds! that is debtor's prison and illegal in this country! there is no exception![/quote:x3p61x4m]

Judges are immune to lawsuits basically - sorry.....

Time is needed for the determination by a Judge..... 8)[/quote:x3p61x4m]



"time is needed for the determination by a Judge" what determination....that was done a century ago by us supreme court when it outlawed debtor's prison's! unless they have changed their minds there is no determination needed! if you are locking someone up for nonpayment of anything you are violating the law! judge or not![/quote:x3p61x4m]

Time to hold a VOP hearing so the judge can determine if it was willful or not. They are not always inclined to take the offender's word on ability to pay especially when restitution is involved.

[quote="worried citizen":3dfcpa4e][quote=Anonymous][quote="worried citizen":3dfcpa4e][quote="Anonymous":3dfcpa4e][quote="wfla just did a story on":3dfcpa4e]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on!

Appeals courts have already ruled on ability to pay but that doesnt stop the unlucky one from sitting in there for a month or so if the judge initially thinks he could have paid or didnt read the circumstances good enough I guess.[/quote:3dfcpa4e]

and you persist in making my point for me! if you place someone in jail even for 1 sec for non payment of funds! that is debtor's prison and illegal in this country! there is no exception![/quote:3dfcpa4e]

Judges are immune to lawsuits basically - sorry.....

Time is needed for the determination by a Judge..... 8)[/quote:3dfcpa4e]



"time is needed for the determination by a Judge" what determination....that was done a century ago by us supreme court when it outlawed debtor's prison's! unless they have changed their minds there is no determination needed! if you are locking someone up for nonpayment of anything you are violating the law! judge or not![/quote:3dfcpa4e]

Time to hold a VOP hearing so the judge can determine if it was willful or not. They are not always inclined to take the offender's word on ability to pay especially when restitution is involved.[/quote:3dfcpa4e]


guest i dont' know if it is wilful or you are just as dense as a lead block.....unless you file charges for intent to defraud....you cannn't lock someone up for not paying a bill doesn't matter what it is.....not even the IRS does that!

[quote=Anonymous][quote="worried citizen":2sbkj1jc][quote=Anonymous][quote="worried citizen":2sbkj1jc][quote="Anonymous":2sbkj1jc][quote="wfla just did a story on":2sbkj1jc]the pinellas county jail is overcrowded, it has more then 50% more criminals then it was bulit for. The number one reason, 0 tolerance, wow surprise. We told them that. It talked about how we could do technical VOP now, yeah right, anyone found one that fits the criteria the Dept set up for a tech vop. lol what a joke the tech vops are.

When the dept. first put in zero tolerance they said if a Judge wanted a technical on certain violations: money, 1st positive drug test etc. they could put it in writing and DOC would follow their wishes, but the Judges with all the media scrutiny didnt want to go out on a limb like that for the most part. The chief Judges didnt want to make a statement for the other Judges etc. So unless DOC gives back some discretion to Officers it will stay this way and I doubt DOC evr gives back true discretion due to the media and its coverage.

violation for lack of money? man could have swore debtor's prison's were made illegal?

They get a VOP with circumstances explained and then the Judge is supposed to rule if it is willful or not, but many times the person sits in jail for a few months, until this is ruled on.

sounds like debtor's prison to me! could have sworn that has illegal in this country for over a centry or better! but guess that was before the U.S created the biggest prison labor system in the world...even surpassing the old Soviet Union and the Present Red Chinese Systems. now need all the inmates they can get their hands on!

Appeals courts have already ruled on ability to pay but that doesnt stop the unlucky one from sitting in there for a month or so if the judge initially thinks he could have paid or didnt read the circumstances good enough I guess.[/quote:2sbkj1jc]

and you persist in making my point for me! if you place someone in jail even for 1 sec for non payment of funds! that is debtor's prison and illegal in this country! there is no exception![/quote:2sbkj1jc]

Judges are immune to lawsuits basically - sorry.....

Time is needed for the determination by a Judge..... 8)[/quote:2sbkj1jc]



"time is needed for the determination by a Judge" what determination....that was done a century ago by us supreme court when it outlawed debtor's prison's! unless they have changed their minds there is no determination needed! if you are locking someone up for nonpayment of anything you are violating the law! judge or not![/quote:2sbkj1jc]

Time to hold a VOP hearing so the judge can determine if it was willful or not. They are not always inclined to take the offender's word on ability to pay especially when restitution is involved.[/quote:2sbkj1jc]


guest i dont' know if it is wilful or you are just as dense as a lead block.....unless you file charges for intent to defraud....you cannn't lock someone up for not paying a bill doesn't matter what it is.....not even the IRS does that![/quote:2sbkj1jc]

I swear you are an idiot citizen - probationers get locked up all the time for non payment of restitution and court costs etc. When you are sentenced to pay something in a criminal case it is a violation of your probation not to pay it. The judge can reduce it to a civil lien later if he feels it is warranted. If we treated probationers like you want nobody would get their restitution probably. Any officer will tell you Judges have signed tons of warrants for failure to pay only and if the judge feels they need a hearing to sort it out they might sit in jail for 2 months or so for just not paying that money. All the appeals courts have done on these cases in Florida is say you need to determine ability to pay and once again the judge can have you held to determine it and he can extend your probation if there is still time remaining with that degree of felony, for example if the guy was sentenced to 3 years prob. for an F3 the judge can add 2 more years to keep paying on his restitution if not paid in those 3 years. You eveidently dont know the realities of this.

't matter what it is.....not even the IRS does that!

I swear you are an idiot citizen - probationers get locked up all the time for non payment of restitution and court costs etc. When you are sentenced to pay something in a criminal case it is a violation of your probation not to pay it. The judge can reduce it to a civil lien later if he feels it is warranted. If we treated probationers like you want nobody would get their restitution probably. Any officer will tell you Judges have signed tons of warrants for failure to pay only and if the judge feels they need a hearing to sort it out they might sit in jail for 2 months or so for just not paying that money. All the appeals courts have done on these cases in Florida is say you need to determine ability to pay and once again the judge can have you held to determine it and he can extend your probation if there is still time remaining with that degree of felony, for example if the guy was sentenced to 3 years prob. for an F3 the judge can add 2 more years to keep paying on his restitution if not paid in those 3 years. You eveidently dont know the realities of this.[/quote]


i know that just because you do it and the local judges let you get away with it doesn't make it legal or constitutional!. just means you are doing it to people who don't have the resources and money to fight back!

't matter what it is.....not even the IRS does that!

I swear you are an idiot citizen - probationers get locked up all the time for non payment of restitution and court costs etc. When you are sentenced to pay something in a criminal case it is a violation of your probation not to pay it. The judge can reduce it to a civil lien later if he feels it is warranted. If we treated probationers like you want nobody would get their restitution probably. Any officer will tell you Judges have signed tons of warrants for failure to pay only and if the judge feels they need a hearing to sort it out they might sit in jail for 2 months or so for just not paying that money. All the appeals courts have done on these cases in Florida is say you need to determine ability to pay and once again the judge can have you held to determine it and he can extend your probation if there is still time remaining with that degree of felony, for example if the guy was sentenced to 3 years prob. for an F3 the judge can add 2 more years to keep paying on his restitution if not paid in those 3 years. You eveidently dont know the realities of this.


i know that just because you do it and the local judges let you get away with it doesn't make it legal or constitutional!. just means you are doing it to people who don't have the resources and money to fight back![/quote]

The example with the extension on the Felony, the guy owed a lot of money and did have a private atty and case law was being mentioned in the court by his attorney and the judge, and the judge said it was proper to extend it and the case was not overturned later.