Investigations

[MOD 613]

It has often been asked what to do when an investigation is initiated. This blog will provide you with answers from experts from investigations, attorneys views, and employee representatives.

SB1062 makes improvements in the law enforcement disciplinary process, specifically, in three areas:

(1.) Specifies that at the conclusion of an interview in which an employer reasonably believes could result in dismissal, demotion or suspension of the law enforcement officer, the officer is entitled to the following:

A period of time to consult with the officer’s representative.
A statement not to exceed five minutes, addressing specific facts or policies that are related to the interview.
(2.) Only allows an employer, except where a statute or ordinance makes the administrative evidentiary hearing the final administrative determination, to amend, modify, reject or reverse a decision made by a hearing officer, administrative law judge or appeals board after a hearing if the following occur:

The officer and employer were equally allowed to call and examine witnesses, cross-examine witnesses, provide documentary evidence and otherwise fully participate in the hearing.
The decision was arbitrary or without reasonable justification.
(3.) Prohibits an employer from including any information about an investigation in the portion of the personnel file of an officer that is available for public inspection and copying until one of the following occurs:

The investigation is complete.
The employer has discontinued the investigation.
Specifies that if the officer has timely appealed a disciplinary action, the investigation is not complete until the conclusion of the appeal process.
History
A.R.S. Section 38-1101 outlines the rights of law enforcement officers regarding interviews the employer reasonably believes could result in dismissal, demotion or suspension. Specifically, officers are allowed to request to have a representative present during the interview. The officer must be permitted reasonable breaks of limited duration for telephonic or in person consultation with others who are immediately available. Additionally, before the commencement of an interview, the employer must provide the officer with a written notice informing the officer of the following: 1) the specific nature of the investigation, 2) the officer’s status in the investigation and 3) all known allegations of misconduct.

A disciplinary action is the dismissal, demotion or suspension for more than 24 hours of an officer that is authorized by statute, charter or ordinance. Disciplinary actions are subject to appeals hearings or other procedures by a local merit board, a civil service board, an administrative law judge (ALJ) or a hearing officer. Employers may amend, modify, reject or reverse the decision of a hearing officer, ALJ or board, but the employer must state the reasons for the amendment, modification, rejection or reversal.

Wasn't that one of the unions bill? cagecop

[MOD 613]

I found this while googling Arizona corrections and employee rights. It was the only thing that came up. The bill was presented by a national law enforcement organization whom they say is the largest in the nation. I did not find anything good from any of the unions out there.
As far as 601’s go you should know your rights. I conferred with an attorney that is part of a union out there. He advised that union membership is key to your defense. He said that he would help any member after their disciplinary for a fee, which I assume is in addition to your union dues. I think an officer could do better by defending them selves or finding some one that could assist them for free if such a thing exists.
Knowing your rights is what I believe is key. Google Rights of Law Enforcement Officers and FSLA. Also Arizona Revised Statutes 13-3811 helps. Read and learn DO 601 and DO 501 and 508. Have a friend that will sit with you because they respect you.
This blog is for answering specific questions. I advise not to discuss a current investigation. You can ask indirect broad questions.
When an investigator requests to talk with you, you need to know if you are the principal of the investigation. Never assume you are not, because what you say may cost you disciplinary action. Ask to have your own recorder and a representative with you. Ask if it is internal affairs or criminal. If it is internal affairs ask for your Garrity Rights. If it is Criminal, shut up and ask for an attorney or call the one you have.
Mod 613

So what do we do if our union failed to help us and I got time off. They said they could'nt do anything for me but they still take my money and they are out there recruiting every week.

[MOD 613]

Hmm, good question there safford sas. Does your "union" have a grievance system? Do they have a legal team that over sees them? Do they have a local board? Most of these "employee organizations" have a board that should report to you. You can contact Phoenix personnel and they can give you the listed charter of members that govern their union. You can call Phoenix from work.

You can look the board members (or have some one look them up) on groupwise or at personnel to find out where they work. Call them at work and put the heavy questions to them. If they are not up to your satisfaction you can then complain about them. You do pay them, they should live up to that service. If complaning about them does not work then vote them out. Now I keep track of all unions and have noticed that it stays the same ole same ole. If you do not like what they do leave them.

Research your rights as a union member at [b]National Right To Work (http://www.NRTW.org, National Legal and Policy Center (http://www.NLPC.org), (http://www.LaborPains.org), Hobbs Act of 2007 at (http://www.wikipedia.org), and (http://www.unionfacts.com).

Now there is only one "employee organization" thet claims to defend your rights, fight for your benifits, and not play union politics to take your constitutional rights away. I am not here to advicate for any specific group, only for you on this blog as an individual. I am here to give the straight facts.

Mod 613

[MOD 613]

Now you folks do know that this blog is for help during "investigations". I can read the minds of all of you and see the confusion and concerns of unions.

Mod 613

I work in Safford. I got 601ed and was told to go toalk to the investigator. I asked to call my representative and was told if I was refusing that I would be fired. So I talked to the investigator alone. I called my union rep and they told me it was to late to help me and it was my fault.

What do I do. Can I grieve and who do I grieve?

[MOD 613]

Let me start like my Ol' Friend Bullethead would. No offense but is your problem like your sign on name "Crazy ans Lazy". Is your 601 based on these attitudes? Act like a prison cop and not crazy and lazy like up in smoke.

Now, seriously, if you are in Safford I imagine that the investigator drove from Tucson and even Phoenix to see several officers in one day. You did not say if it was criminal or an administrative investigation, so it is hard to give a good comment. In department Order 501, you must be professional at all times. We are Law Enforcement Officers and represent the government of Arizona and the United States. We took an oath to do just that. Now as for an investigation, it is for your benifit. A PACE entry IS NOT a write up. An NNTI or Letter of Instruction is not a write up. An officila write up is official disciplinary as per DO601 deffinitions is "Written reprimand, suspension, or dismissal that comes from an administrator. So relax, it is a technical jomb that takes alot of focus. So focus on your job, do it write, and avoid disciplinary. Pace entries you will get alot of , positive and negative. Fighting a PACE entry is a waste when you get to make your own comment as well. It is when you are not allowed to make a comment or get a poor score is when you grieve. There used be a time that they did not do an investigation, you were either suspended or fired.

Now to some answers. I am just assuming that the investigator came from Phoenix since most CIU on the Complex are criminal for inmates and visitors (don't hold me to that). According to DO 601.04 you should have received noticed prior to the interview and would have had plenty of time to get an observer. You can use any employee to be an observer according to DO 601.05. Even on the day of the interview you could ask for an observer and the interview should have been allowed to delay for no more than 2 hours. If this was not allowed and they pulled the old "If you refuse to cooperate you can be fired" line then you have a grievance under DO 517.

Hey, my union just left while I am under investigation! WTF do I do now, i dont know what to do. Who do I call, the warden told me that they dont do referals.

Hey, my union just left while I am under investigation! WTF do I do now, i dont know what to do. Who do I call, the warden told me that they dont do referals.

The rep just call me back and told me she dont do it any more because of the investigation they are going through and she dont want to get in trouble. I ask for my dues back so I can get a lawyer and she said that she can not get ahold of the guy in phoenix that has all the money. They told me at cota that they where the best now what?

[MOD 613]

Hey, my union just left while I am under investigation! WTF do I do now, i dont know what to do. Who do I call, the warden told me that they dont do referals.

The rep just call me back and told me she dont do it any more because of the investigation they are going through and she dont want to get in trouble. I ask for my dues back so I can get a lawyer and she said that she can not get ahold of the guy in phoenix that has all the money. They told me at cota that they where the best now what?



I love when I get e-mails like this. E-mail me direct to the MOD 613. If you would like let me know what is going on, where you work, who you are, your rank, etc. I will ask if I can post some of your story minus your name and spacifices. Then I will look around in your area to see who can help you, I know alot of people.

What is sad is that no matter which department in law enforcement there is, there is no employee assistance for those in trouble, only for the department. This is why there has to be "employee organizations" as this department calls them. This is the main reason that I chose to be of some assistance to those that do not know how to help them selves.

I will only tell you fact based on policy and the law. I do not provide defense or write your responses. I know alot people that are willing to help. Unfurtunately my best advice is to join one of the "employee organizations' because in the line of duty you may have to shoot some one. I have a religious conviction against unions so there is only one organization that I can or will belong to. I will not suggest you to join or who to join, I will only say is do your research. You would not invest your money with the loudest bank that say they are the best when they do not even have tellers would you?

[MOD 613]

Well, that was an interesting conversation. It took me awhile to break through the propaganda and ideology of what this Officers union tells their members. Let’s talk about mistake vs. misconduct. Mistake is just that, a mistake. Misconduct is you meant and were willing to violate a rule, procedure, law, or policy. If you were speeding, you meant and were willing to violate the law and you deserve a ticket. If the speed sign changed and you did not see it then you mistakenly broke the law and may get a ticket or may get a warning. If you go to court the judge may throw it out or may make you pay only court costs. We have all been through that.

We do not get a free ride. This Officer, a father knows quite well after I used his supervision of his children as an example. Why would he feel that he could violate safety and security procedures and want to get away with it with no corrective action? He does not let his children get away with bad conduct, no matter how long ago they did it. LAW ENFORCEMENT IS NO DIFFERENT. When I make a mistake I can be fired on the spot!! No rights!! When "line staff" make a mistake or have misconduct they have rights. They have the right to due process, a trial if you wish, and are allowed to state their side and call witnesses to their reasoning of the action that led to the mistake. Where, beside some organizations BS they say that is not true or reasonable, would you think that you should not be held accountable.

Though the difference would be reasonable and prudent. Was your record taken into account, was the circumstances taken into account. If you have no disciplinary and 100 call ins you may get time off. If you have no call in s and a poor pace score and entries for willingness to not follow directions you may get time off. If you are a good Officer then maybe you should not get time off. If you do and feel it is not fair then you can grieve it. This is when you may want to seek some one that is good at grievances.

It is a fact that Officers have been killed or injured because of complacency. In the correctional unwritten dictionary the definition of COMPLACENCY is "an employee’s willingness to short cut, violate or ignore safety, security, procedures and policies to do their job easier to the health and safety of their fellow employees." Complacency kills in every type career in the world.

So in short, with this Officers permission, this Officer screwed up. He became complacent and had forgotten about the rule he violated and did not know of a memo that had come out about a change in procedures, a mistake. He felt comfortable being a leader of peers and running his yard and failed to notify a supervisor of his action, this was misconduct. He IS a darn good Officer and a hero in my books. He is just not versed in the investigations and disciplinary process. The gentleman that I know in his neck of the woods is having heart surgery so I suggested some one out of Phoenix to help him. After a lengthy discussion and my placing this Officer in the Administrators shoes, he agreed he boo booed and feels that a couple of days off would be warranted. The guy I sent him to is now negotiating this with administration instead of the termination they want. We will keep you updated.

I work in (Removed by moderator for privacy reasons), probably many have not heard of us since we are alllllllll alone. I got myself in a little trouble due to my opinion at work. It is something that I already admitted to and apologized for on my 601. It was not political or threatening to anyone, racist, derogetory, or sexist but it was unprofessional and would warrant a letter of reprimand at max. Now they are telling me that CIU is coming all the way here from phoenix to interigate me. I called my buddy who is the (Removed by moderator for privacy for the buddy) rep here. He says that they are shut down and that he was not told anything. He says that he does not know what to do for me.

What do I do, who do I call, please help!!!!!!!

[MOD 613]

I work in (Removed by moderator for privacy reasons), probably many have not heard of us since we are alllllllll alone. I got myself in a little trouble due to my opinion at work. It is something that I already admitted to and apologized for on my 601. It was not political or threatening to anyone, racist, derogetory, or sexist but it was unprofessional and would warrant a letter of reprimand at max. Now they are telling me that CIU is coming all the way here from phoenix to interigate me. I called my buddy who is the (Removed by moderator for privacy for the buddy) rep here. He says that they are shut down and that he was not told anything. He says that he does not know what to do for me.

What do I do, who do I call, please help!!!!!!!

Sorry for the long time to reply folks, but things happen at our job that requires us to focus on tactics rather than blogging.

We talk about investigations and the disciplinary that the department’s administration hands out. To me, at this point, it seems to be all over the place. There is no consistency with how disciplinary is used or administered to its employees. My boss just served several weeks off for an Officers mistake at another complex. The Officer got 8 hours off for something that the Officer at minimum should have gotten 80 hours for. So you can see how we are held responsible as well.

I had a long talk with this Officer above. This Officer is going through a tough divorce, may lose half of the retirement that the Officer has worked so hard to get, and has to work at the most dangerous and stressful job in America. This does not excuse what the Officer snapped at his supervisor with. At the maximum this Officer should get 8 hours off and at minimum our DEPARTMENT should have used its CIRT to get this Officer counseling and re-assignment to a lower level yard or no inmate contact. The Officer admitted to the incident and apologized for it, for administration to use investigators to talk to him would be a waste of resources. The request for the investigation was over the top, but they on their own, scaled it back. This Officer received an NNTI.

Now, I referred this Officer to a CHAPLAIN at his complex. Chaplains I feel are the best tool to use since they are better trained in stress debriefing and are certified. They also do not report to the department the finite details of the Officers life.

Today, this Officer e-mailed and said that the Chaplain has helped with marriage counseling and that the Officers spouse is considering working through each other’s stress. Is that not how things should go instead of making people feel worse? Discipline is to hold you accountable not to mentally punish you.

This guy at work is trying to tell me to join the new union or that doc will have the power to fire me no matter what like Wis. I told him that I have a religious conviction against belonging to unions and such and they are useless and just take your money and leave you hanging. I didn't need them when I worked for the mines and not now. I heard from this guy that is a retired lt that recruits at the gate that they get laws change to protect us at work.

For my own benifit what are these laws and how can I find them. I have always worried about my self and what I do and not the ones that get you in trouble. I would like to know these laws if they exist so I can have them in my tool box when and if needed.

JJ

"you can call me JJ, but don't call me Guey Guey."