New Ranks

Wow...... just read that FHP Command wants to spend over 1 MILLION dollars so that we can have a "Trooper Specialist"..... "Senior Trooper"....... "Trooper First Class",.... and a " Master Trooper" along with SGT. 1st class etc.... W T F ???? a million dollars so that some that went to college can have a NEW title ?? don't we have MORE pressing problems to deal with these days ????

Contact your State Reps. and tell them to use that money to give us a decent raise, NOT a new chevron for the uniform..... NO way will the Senate and the House allow this "pork barrell project" to live on..........

funny thing is that i read that after 2 yrs and with the right amount of college credits you can be a "senior trooper".... i'm just saying ............

Capt. Succi.... what is your opinion on this ??? will it or can it work ????

Wow...... just read that FHP Command wants to spend over 1 MILLION dollars so that we can have a "Trooper Specialist"..... "Senior Trooper"....... "Trooper First Class",.... and a " Master Trooper" along with SGT. 1st class etc.... W T F ???? a million dollars so that some that went to college can have a NEW title ?? don't we have MORE pressing problems to deal with these days ????

Contact your State Reps. and tell them to use that money to give us a decent raise, NOT a new chevron for the uniform..... NO way will the Senate and the House allow this "pork barrell project" to live on..........

Can you be as stupid as you write. Just stay in your zone and work your crashes.

[Captain Succi]

Capt. Succi.... what is your opinion on this ??? will it or can it work ????

I'm all for the rank structure if it gets the pay up. I have not seen exactly how this works, but if it is based on who has college and who does not, then I don't think it is fair.

It should be based on length of service and evaluations. Example, Trooper has 5 years and satisfactory evaluation then he/she becomes Trooper 1st Class. If he/she has any below standards, then he/she should not be given the rank and money, but have to wait until the next evaluation.

My thoughts on college is that it is nice to have and I applaud anyone with a degree. I prefer someone with a degree from the University of Hard Knock. We already give incentive money for those with a degree so the new rank structure should not be tied to college.

Now before I get blasted, I have BA in Public Administration and a Masters in Criminal Justice, all obtained after being employed with FHP. When I need help I don't care if you have a degree or make more money, I just want you to have the guts to jump in. As they say, "Been there, done that!"

We all know that this will not happen, the Florida state budget is in dire danger of having to be radically slashed!!! FHP, and all other state leo's, simply will NOT get any raise or opportunity to enhance their salaries (other than 208). Besides, wasn't this proposed before? Several times if I am not mistaken, and they were soundly rejected. Sure, It would make sense to implement this program but it simply will not happen this year. We will be lucky to get by on our current salaries and not take a paycut. The budget process will be nothing short of a bloodbath this year. I am not trying to be negative, just being a realist.

If they tie any money to the new rank structure then the pay compression will get worse. There is already no incentive to make lieutenant. Most sergeants make more than a lieutenant as it is.

Yeah, spending 4 years in college and spending $40,000+ to get a degree shouldn't count for anything. It is more important to give the money to a Trooper or Sergeant that spends 2 weeks in Tallahassee attending a leadership course. :snicker: This agency has always been hostile to higher education while some other agencies won't even hire you without a degree. This agency does not believe in rewarding hard work. No sense in working harder than the next guy. Your pay will always be the same.

Czernis has already approved the new rank structure. However, you will have to buy your new insignia yourself.

[I Wear The Hat]

Czernis has already approved the new rank structure. However, you will have to buy your new insignia yourself.
"Puchase-to-carry" insgnia. Now THAT'S funny! :snicker:

See, the sad thing about a guy like you is, in 50 years you're gonna start doin' some thinkin' on your own and you're going to come up with the fact that there are two certainties in life: one, don't do that, and two, you dropped 150 grand on a f***in' education you could have got for a dollar fifty in late charges at the public library! You already get money for your degree. How about have some compensation for service members. You will find that people who served are going to be the ones that are better leaders.

:idea:
First, a disclaimer. I have several graduate degrees from traditional, residential, fully accredited universities.

Next, I see the PROPOSED FHP "new rank titles" to enable documentation of achievement of troopers' higher skill levels to JUSTIFY HIGHER compensation--not more compensation for simply having put another 15,000 miles on a CVPI during the year. More able and experienced troopers and supervisors should enable FHP to demand more productivity, with a higher level of efficiency from its people who earn increased compensation.

Finally, today's labor pool currently requires FHP to compete for people with more formal education --- who expect to be paid more, for more productivity. They expect a return on their educational investments (and some --the current "entitlement generation" -- expect to be paid more, because they think they are doing the world a favor coming to work at all! :x ).

While my prospective is based upon a lot of formal education AND A LOT OF EXPERIENCE, all my degrees were earned through traditional course work and a research dissertation--no correspondence courses, no on-line courses, no mail order transcripts/degrees, and no weekend courses. And, yes, I was employed full-time while I EARNED these degrees.

During the years of earning my degrees, my family suffered (for the expected long run benefit of higher compensation--which was achieved). While working on my degrees, my personal life was nil. I EARNED the degrees for an expected higher rate of return on the educational investment from employment OPPORTUNITIES that required higher degrees for higher paying positions.

I urge you to not dismiss the proposed rank structure. Society demands that its "legally plundered income by government" (taxes) be used to produce public goods--but, with increasing accountability. Taxpayers will not permit more compensation for the same productivity. If you want more compensation, you need to produce more, produce better, produce faster, and/or produce at less complementary costs. "There is no free lunch."

Nobody get it, if there ain't none.

If you want to earn more, learn more--on the job and/or from documented and appropriate formal education.

I hope I didn't offend Capt. J.S., nor any other FHP "brass!"
:idea:

See, the sad thing about a guy like you is, in 50 years you're gonna start doin' some thinkin' on your own and you're going to come up with the fact that there are two certainties in life: one, don't do that, and two, you dropped 150 grand on a f***in' education you could have got for a dollar fifty in late charges at the public library! You already get money for your degree. How about have some compensation for service members. You will find that people who served are going to be the ones that are better leaders.

That’s funny and very witty: The sad thing is that most of the good people are leaving and they are the one with a degree. I believe in experience but having a degree show disciple and self motivation. I could leave right now and make double what I could if I stayed and that’s starting out. For those of you that think we are compensated for our degrees you are so mistaken. I get 80.00 a month for a B.A in criminology and two minors. Do the math (24000.00) after a 25 year career. Not even close to the time and cost of what I paid. I was lucky the military helped me. I don’t want to leave I enjoy being a trooper and money is not everything. But for anyone to say we are already compensated well I have a lot of issues with that.
On a another note: Just because you have worked for an agency for (x) amount of years has nothing to do with being a good leader.

Some of the worst troopers and supervisors we have on the patrol have 4 year college degrees, yet they can't make a simple decision that shows common sense.

It doesn't matter how many stripes you wear or the so called leadership classes you attend, you will not be compensated. Its the same year after year, work more, write more, do more with less, the legislature understands and is there for you just like us (the executive staff). It will not change. The department has the ability to give all of us a raise every year by using rate money. They CHOOSE not to. Its easier to maintain the status quo than to stand up and do the right thing. The executive staff can develop whatever they want, until they start caring and doing the right thing, its just smoke and mirrors and I will continue to work only as hard as what they are paying for.

Trooper 5,

When I was referring to service I meant military service not service with FHP. The state does not and never has offered any money for the men and women who put their lives on the line. You cannot learn those leadership traits in a class room as you should know based on your post. You should have something that shows dedication and commitment. Things such as college, military service, a stable work history, or financial responsibility or any combination of the aforementioned. It really bothers me that just because someone spent who knows how long or got who knows what kind of grades think that they are entitled to more. The hardest thing about college is not the work, I have been there, it is balancing parting, hot chicks, and getting to class on time. Wooderson - Yeah, man, that's where all the girls are right? But I'd just as soon keep workin', though, keep a little change in my pocket. Better than listenin' to some dipshit, doesn't know what the hell he's talkin' about, anyway! I am a better person and learned more about life and how to be a leader from the university of USMC :evil: than I did in any college classroom.

Captain Succi,

What is the reality of this new proposal? Will it happen?

ok, here is what other states REALLY do......

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-10 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-20 Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more

20 + Yrs----------- Master Trooper-----------+$ 300 per month more

same thing for sergeants (time in grade)

it's a simple fix, and it rewards those that choose to stay.

Troopers deserve to be acknowledged for their expertise and abilities. While obtaining a college degree is admirable, it should be one of many factors that go into designating members as "senior" or "master" troopers. In addition to a college education, credit should be given to members who have completed advanced training and demostrated superior work performance. For example the department could devise a system where the following factors would be evaluated in conferring a "1st class", "senior", or "master designation." 1. Completion of a set curriculum of training courses designed to encourage a mastery of the trooper skill set. 2. Completion of a set time in grade. 3. Above average performance appraisal 4. Completion of formal education 5. Completion of leadership training. The list is not exhaustive but this type of program would give members an opportunity who seek opportunities for professional development an alternative to simply taking a promotional exam and climbing the management rank structure. We have excellent troopers who deserve to be acknowledged by our department for their competency and committment to the FHP mission. Some people have commented that they would like to see each "promotion" accompanied with a pay increase. I think that it is not unreasonable to expect a pay raise but those individuals who are truly committed and deserving of acquiring "senior" status. The proof will be in the details but it sounds like a move in the right direction.

The colonel said they were going to implement the class structure w/o the money attached to it. That was last month when he talked to our in-service class.

ok, here is what other states REALLY do......

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-10 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-20 Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more

20 + Yrs----------- Master Trooper-----------+$ 300 per month more

same thing for sergeants (time in grade)

it's a simple fix, and it rewards those that choose to stay.

This doesn't make any sense. You are a 20 year Trooper. On your 21st year, you decide to make Sergeant. If you had stayed a Trooper, you'd have gotten a $300 pay raise. Since you made the stupid decision to take the Sergeant test, you aren't going to get any raise whatsoever because you have no significant time in grade? Why would you consider promoting if you can get a raise by doing nothing at all? Sounds like more compression issues and some rewarded while others get screwed.

We already have Supervisors who make less then everybody they supervise. This will make it ever worse. Now a 4 year Sergeant who makes far less than those he supervises will have to sit back and watch them get a $300 per month pay raise while he doesn't get jack, and he may have been with FHP for 19 years. Thanks a lot.

Trooper 5,

When I was referring to service I meant military service not service with FHP. The state does not and never has offered any money for the men and women who put their lives on the line. You cannot learn those leadership traits in a class room as you should know based on your post. You should have something that shows dedication and commitment. Things such as college, military service, a stable work history, or financial responsibility or any combination of the aforementioned. It really bothers me that just because someone spent who knows how long or got who knows what kind of grades think that they are entitled to more. The hardest thing about college is not the work, I have been there, it is balancing parting, hot chicks, and getting to class on time. Wooderson - Yeah, man, that's where all the girls are right? But I'd just as soon keep workin', though, keep a little change in my pocket. Better than listenin' to some dipshit, doesn't know what the hell he's talkin' about, anyway! I am a better person and learned more about life and how to be a leader from the university of USMC :evil: than I did in any college classroom.


I understand your post and agree with that. However when I left the my beloved corps I went to college. I was not there to chase skirts I struggled for everything. To just look over someone with education is just wrong. I can give the same agruement that some supervisors and troopers with out degrees are idiots. Trust me I have been around long enough to have seen alot of people who either should not have been promoted or even hired. My agruement is that our agency needs to be able to compete with the feds and other agencies who has education requirements and pay a heck of lot more.
Semper Fi

We already have Supervisors who make less then everybody they supervise. This will make it ever worse. Now a 4 year Sergeant who makes far less than those he supervises will have to sit back and watch them get a $300 per month pay raise while he doesn't get jack, and he may have been with FHP for 19 years. Thanks a lot.

Your point is valid and would be overcome with a well designed compensation program tied to the proposed ranks.

The solution to your issue is to have the minimum starting pay for sergeants be above the median of all trooper pay ranks. The top-out pay for a sergeant would be well above (perhaps 60% higher) the highest trooper ranks' pay. Time in rank at FHP should matter. And for a new sergeant who is supervising a squad of seasoned, tenured troopers, it is logical that while the NEW supervisor is learning the job, his/her pay MIGHT be lower than SOME of the troopers he supervises. The one caveat is that ALL PROMOTIONS have a minimum pay that exceeds the PROMOTED individual's previous pay prior to his/her promotion.

For example, if a 25 year "maxed-out" trooper's pay is $45,000 and that 25 year trooper then promotes to a sergeant's position, his/her pay would be a minimum of 12% above his/her previous pay position (trooper). This compensation plan is not hard to set up, be understood by employees, and BE FAIR to everyone based upon years of acceptable service with FHP, FHP rank held, and years in that FHP rank.

NEW supervisors will rise above the troopers he/she supervises as his/her "time in grade" grows. This process is used in just about all private sector employment. Even the FEDs pay-grade-scale has a similar characteristic program.

On the separate issued raised elsewhere, pay at FHP for military service is INAPPROPRIATE. Service people were paid for their time in the military. To pay them for years in military service, at FHP also, would be UNFAIR to all others who worked at FHP as it would double count the same years. That is a VERY BAD IDEA, and would create a lot of morale problems that don't currently exist. Don't even think about going in that direction or the problems it creates will be overwhelming !

You are wrong because we get no step raises, the people who make more than me will always make more than me until they retire or I promote to maybe captain...

I agree with above post. The comments were well-meant, but I don't think this person realizes how screwed up our compression is. I know a Sergeant with 20+ years on FHP who supervised 5 Troopers and 4 of them made more money than him and didn't have their 25 years yet. I can understand a 7 year Trooper who makes Sergeant not making as much as a 25 year Trooper he is supervising, but if he has 20 years on, he shouldn't still be making less than a 25 year Trooper. It gets worse. He also was a THI and despite that additional raise, he still made less than a road Trooper with just a couple years seniority :shock:

These new ranks are just another joke and a way to try and divert your attention from the real problems within FHP, like low pay and no raises even in boom times.

Czernis can stick these new ranks right up his arse!!!

ok, here is what other states REALLY do......

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-10 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-20 Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more

20 + Yrs----------- Master Trooper-----------+$ 300 per month more

same thing for sergeants (time in grade)

it's a simple fix, and it rewards those that choose to stay.



This was KG's idea and CZ supported it.

I think its a bad idea. Putting money to all these ranks will create a bad case of compression.

Its too many ranks and it lessens the value of each rank when everyone has it!

Its also confusing, because there are too many ranks, you dont know which is which and the requirements.

Obviously someone did not do the research with other Highway Patrol/State Police. They dont have these many ranks elsewhere.

I agree we should have something, however it should be simple, easily recognizable and not busy.

I recommend the following:

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-15 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-+ Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Corporal (As a Cpl) --------------- 0 more per month

5-+ Yrs------------Senior Corporal---------+$ 100 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Sergeant (As a Sgt) --------------- 0 more per month

5--20 Yrs------------Senior Sgt---------.............+$ 100 per month more

20 +Yrs.............Master Sgt..........................$200.00 Per Month


Keep it simple, easily recognizable.

If you do it the other way, then everyone will have some type of rank on their sleeve. Then that term will be common "Anyobe can have it, The only requirement is to be breathing.

You will get NOTHING and work harder.....

ok, here is what other states REALLY do......

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-10 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-20 Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more

20 + Yrs----------- Master Trooper-----------+$ 300 per month more

same thing for sergeants (time in grade)

it's a simple fix, and it rewards those that choose to stay.





This was KG's idea and CZ supported it.

I think its a bad idea. Putting money to all these ranks will create a bad case of compression.

Its too many ranks and it lessens the value of each rank when everyone has it!

Its also confusing, because there are too many ranks, you dont know which is which and the requirements.

Obviously someone did not do the research with other Highway Patrol/State Police. They dont have these many ranks elsewhere.

I agree we should have something, however it should be simple, easily recognizable and not busy.

I recommend the following:

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-15 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-+ Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Corporal (As a Cpl) --------------- 0 more per month

5-+ Yrs------------Senior Corporal---------+$ 100 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Sergeant (As a Sgt) --------------- 0 more per month

5--20 Yrs------------Senior Sgt---------.............+$ 100 per month more

20 +Yrs.............Master Sgt..........................$200.00 Per Month


Keep it simple, easily recognizable.

If you do it the other way, then everyone will have some type of rank on their sleeve. Then that term will be common "Anyobe can have it, The only requirement is to be breathing.

WHY DID YOU SCREW THE SERGEANT? YOU DON'T BECOME A SERGEANT RIGHT OUT OF THE ACADEMY. YOU WILL PROBABLY HAVE 5+ YEARS ON BEFORE YOU MAKE THE DECISION TO TAKE THE STRIPES. UNDER YOUR TIMEFRAME, AN EMPLOYEE WHO MAKES SERGEANT THAT HAS 5+ YEARS EMPLOYMENT WILL FINALLY BECOME A MASTER SERGEANT AT HIS RETIREMENT DINNER. THAT'S LIKE MAKING YOU PAY INTO THE SOCIAL SECURITY SYSTEM YOUR ENTIRE LIFE AND TELLING YOU THAT YOU CAN'T DRAW OUT OF THE SYSTEM TILL YOU ARE 90 YEARS OLD. YOU'LL NEVER BE COMPENSATED FOR WHAT YOU PUT INTO IT. HOPE YOU ARE NOT ON THE COMMITTEE THAT CAME UP WITH THIS PROPOSAL. :shock:

Capt. Succi.... what is your opinion on this ??? will it or can it work ????

I'm all for the rank structure if it gets the pay up. I have not seen exactly how this works, but if it is based on who has college and who does not, then I don't think it is fair.

It should be based on length of service and evaluations. Example, Trooper has 5 years and satisfactory evaluation then he/she becomes Trooper 1st Class. If he/she has any below standards, then he/she should not be given the rank and money, but have to wait until the next evaluation.

My thoughts on college is that it is nice to have and I applaud anyone with a degree. I prefer someone with a degree from the University of Hard Knock. We already give incentive money for those with a degree so the new rank structure should not be tied to college.

Now before I get blasted, I have BA in Public Administration and a Masters in Criminal Justice, all obtained after being employed with FHP. When I need help I don't care if you have a degree or make more money, I just want you to have the guts to jump in. As they say, "Been there, done that!"

First and foremost, I respect you, Captain Succi, and all the officers and citizens like myself who post on here. However, with that being said this thread could not be anymore demoralizing. As someone who currently tutors and plans to teach higher education, the feeling that a degree should not merit the effort put in is disheartening.

I understand the agency compensates by giving an $80/month pay incentive for those with Bachelors degrees. However, with the State of Florida allowing public universities to increase tuition this year by 15%, this does not cover even inflation. The average tuition in Florida costs $5k per semester; this does not include books, boarding, and other living expenses. The average graduate looks at $250/month in student loan payments after graduation.

Here are a couple of links about Higher Education in Police Agencies:

This is a great article about the Issue with Higher Education in Police Agencies: http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/speeches/police.htm

Here is the most up to date information I could find about Educational Incentives for State Police Agencies is all 50 states:
http://www.cga.ct.gov/2001/rpt/olr/htm/2001-r-0092.htm

If you notice most states offer tuition reimbursement which pays off most to all of the student's loans (un/subsidized federal loans). Why do you believe they would do this? Because they understand that these officers have the opportunity to move to more lucrative positions in other agencies or fields. This is not to say they're more valuable, but just like a company likes to promote how many employees within their company have degrees, so do these agencies. It is a marketing tool. Potentials look at the statistics and think either "wow, this agency values degrees" or "wow, this means I can obtain a degree while employed". If you don't believe me, take any Advanced Statistics and Inference course.

Before people believe I’m looking at this from only one side, I’m not. I understand the frustration of those who want to pursue higher education, but can’t due to the demands while being employed with this agency. I understand you, Captain Succi, earned your degree while being employed with the Highway Patrol, but that is not a reality that most Troopers here are able to do. Most Troopers are still earning entry level salaries and compensating their pay by working details. Most do not have the luxury or a stable schedule either that can accommodate courses, unless they are on-line. Let’s face it, not everyone wants an education from Phoenix College since the degree isn't worth the paper it's printed on. In this situation what do they do? This is where restructuring SHOULD begin if the agency believes that a higher education is important. But at last, they do not.

If the FHP valued higher education they would offer realistic compensation.
Right now, a person with a BS/BA gets a grand total of $80 a month extra, before taxes, however, anyone with a MS/MA gets nothing past the $80 a month. What a slap in the face!!!! No wonder people who get a MS/MA while working at FHP rarely stick around. People want to be compensated for their advanced degree, and there are plenty of agencies around that will do that!

No where in this "new rank structure" does it give anyone any type of credit for higher education.

[quote=Guest]Capt. Succi.... what is your opinion on this ??? will it or can it work ????

I'm all for the rank structure if it gets the pay up. I have not seen exactly how this works, but if it is based on who has college and who does not, then I don't think it is fair.

It should be based on length of service and evaluations. Example, Trooper has 5 years and satisfactory evaluation then he/she becomes Trooper 1st Class. If he/she has any below standards, then he/she should not be given the rank and money, but have to wait until the next evaluation.

My thoughts on college is that it is nice to have and I applaud anyone with a degree. I prefer someone with a degree from the University of Hard Knock. We already give incentive money for those with a degree so the new rank structure should not be tied to college.

Now before I get blasted, I have BA in Public Administration and a Masters in Criminal Justice, all obtained after being employed with FHP. When I need help I don't care if you have a degree or make more money, I just want you to have the guts to jump in. As they say, "Been there, done that!"

First and foremost, I respect you, Captain Succi, and all the officers and citizens like myself who post on here. However, with that being said this thread could not be anymore demoralizing. As someone who currently tutors and plans to teach higher education, the feeling that a degree should not merit the effort put in is disheartening.

I understand the agency compensates by giving an $80/month pay incentive for those with Bachelors degrees. However, with the State of Florida allowing public universities to increase tuition this year by 15%, this does not cover even inflation. The average tuition in Florida costs $5k per semester; this does not include books, boarding, and other living expenses. The average graduate looks at $250/month in student loan payments after graduation.

Here are a couple of links about Higher Education in Police Agencies:

This is a great article about the Issue with Higher Education in Police Agencies: http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/nij/speeches/police.htm

Here is the most up to date information I could find about Educational Incentives for State Police Agencies is all 50 states:
http://www.cga.ct.gov/2001/rpt/olr/htm/2001-r-0092.htm

If you notice most states offer tuition reimbursement which pays off most to all of the student's loans (un/subsidized federal loans). Why do you believe they would do this? Because they understand that these officers have the opportunity to move to more lucrative positions in other agencies or fields. This is not to say they're more valuable, but just like a company likes to promote how many employees within their company have degrees, so do these agencies. It is a marketing tool. Potentials look at the statistics and think either "wow, this agency values degrees" or "wow, this means I can obtain a degree while employed". If you don't believe me, take any Advanced Statistics and Inference course.

Before people believe I’m looking at this from only one side, I’m not. I understand the frustration of those who want to pursue higher education, but can’t due to the demands while being employed with this agency. I understand you, Captain Succi, earned your degree while being employed with the Highway Patrol, but that is not a reality that most Troopers here are able to do. Most Troopers are still earning entry level salaries and compensating their pay by working details. Most do not have the luxury or a stable schedule either that can accommodate courses, unless they are on-line. Let’s face it, not everyone wants an education from Phoenix College since the degree isn't worth the paper it's printed on. In this situation what do they do? This is where restructuring SHOULD begin if the agency believes that a higher education is important. But at last, they do not.[/quote:1sf8cy2s]

Good post and thanks for the links

If the FHP valued higher education they would offer realistic compensation.
Right now, a person with a BS/BA gets a grand total of $80 a month extra, before taxes, however, anyone with a MS/MA gets nothing past the $80 a month. What a slap in the face!!!! No wonder people who get a MS/MA while working at FHP rarely stick around. People want to be compensated for their advanced degree, and there are plenty of agencies around that will do that!

No where in this "new rank structure" does it give anyone any type of credit for higher education.

I agree...why no extra $ for Masters?

ok, here is what other states REALLY do......

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-10 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-20 Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more

20 + Yrs----------- Master Trooper-----------+$ 300 per month more

same thing for sergeants (time in grade)

it's a simple fix, and it rewards those that choose to stay.





This was KG's idea and CZ supported it.

I think its a bad idea. Putting money to all these ranks will create a bad case of compression.

Its too many ranks and it lessens the value of each rank when everyone has it!

Its also confusing, because there are too many ranks, you dont know which is which and the requirements.

Obviously someone did not do the research with other Highway Patrol/State Police. They dont have these many ranks elsewhere.

I agree we should have something, however it should be simple, easily recognizable and not busy.

I recommend the following:

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-15 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-+ Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Corporal (As a Cpl) --------------- 0 more per month

5-+ Yrs------------Senior Corporal---------+$ 100 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Sergeant (As a Sgt) --------------- 0 more per month

5--20 Yrs------------Senior Sgt---------.............+$ 100 per month more

20 +Yrs.............Master Sgt..........................$200.00 Per Month


Keep it simple, easily recognizable.

If you do it the other way, then everyone will have some type of rank on their sleeve. Then that term will be common "Anyobe can have it, The only requirement is to be breathing.

WHY DID YOU SCREW THE SERGEANT? YOU DON'T BECOME A SERGEANT RIGHT OUT OF THE ACADEMY. YOU WILL PROBABLY HAVE 5+ YEARS ON BEFORE YOU MAKE THE DECISION TO TAKE THE STRIPES. UNDER YOUR TIMEFRAME, AN EMPLOYEE WHO MAKES SERGEANT THAT HAS 5+ YEARS EMPLOYMENT WILL FINALLY BECOME A MASTER SERGEANT AT HIS RETIREMENT DINNER. THAT'S LIKE MAKING YOU PAY INTO THE SOCIAL SECURITY SYSTEM YOUR ENTIRE LIFE AND TELLING YOU THAT YOU CAN'T DRAW OUT OF THE SYSTEM TILL YOU ARE 90 YEARS OLD. YOU'LL NEVER BE COMPENSATED FOR WHAT YOU PUT INTO IT. HOPE YOU ARE NOT ON THE COMMITTEE THAT CAME UP WITH THIS PROPOSAL. :shock:

There are no handouts or entitlements here. If you want something then make that decision to get on the bus.

Instead of complaining, whining and not offering a solution. What do you recommend?

Remember, for the Sgt and Cpl ranks, its time in grade not time in service..

ok, here is what other states REALLY do......

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-10 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-20 Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more

20 + Yrs----------- Master Trooper-----------+$ 300 per month more

same thing for sergeants (time in grade)

it's a simple fix, and it rewards those that choose to stay.





This was KG's idea and CZ supported it.

I think its a bad idea. Putting money to all these ranks will create a bad case of compression.

Its too many ranks and it lessens the value of each rank when everyone has it!

Its also confusing, because there are too many ranks, you dont know which is which and the requirements.

Obviously someone did not do the research with other Highway Patrol/State Police. They dont have these many ranks elsewhere.

I agree we should have something, however it should be simple, easily recognizable and not busy.

I recommend the following:

1-5 Yrs--------------Trooper --------------- 0 more per month

5-15 Yrs------------Trooper 1st Class---------+$ 100 per month more

15-+ Yrs-----------Senior Trooper ----------+ $ 200 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Corporal (As a Cpl) --------------- 0 more per month

5-+ Yrs------------Senior Corporal---------+$ 100 per month more


1-5 Yrs--------------Sergeant (As a Sgt) --------------- 0 more per month

5--20 Yrs------------Senior Sgt---------.............+$ 100 per month more

20 +Yrs.............Master Sgt..........................$200.00 Per Month


Keep it simple, easily recognizable.

If you do it the other way, then everyone will have some type of rank on their sleeve. Then that term will be common "Anyobe can have it, The only requirement is to be breathing.

WHY DID YOU SCREW THE SERGEANT? YOU DON'T BECOME A SERGEANT RIGHT OUT OF THE ACADEMY. YOU WILL PROBABLY HAVE 5+ YEARS ON BEFORE YOU MAKE THE DECISION TO TAKE THE STRIPES. UNDER YOUR TIMEFRAME, AN EMPLOYEE WHO MAKES SERGEANT THAT HAS 5+ YEARS EMPLOYMENT WILL FINALLY BECOME A MASTER SERGEANT AT HIS RETIREMENT DINNER. THAT'S LIKE MAKING YOU PAY INTO THE SOCIAL SECURITY SYSTEM YOUR ENTIRE LIFE AND TELLING YOU THAT YOU CAN'T DRAW OUT OF THE SYSTEM TILL YOU ARE 90 YEARS OLD. YOU'LL NEVER BE COMPENSATED FOR WHAT YOU PUT INTO IT. HOPE YOU ARE NOT ON THE COMMITTEE THAT CAME UP WITH THIS PROPOSAL. :shock:

There are no handouts or entitlements here. If you want something then make that decision to get on the bus.

Instead of complaining, whining and not offering a solution. What do you recommend?

Remember, for the Sgt and Cpl ranks, its time in grade not time in service..

So you feel that sergeants should have to spend just about their entire career in that rank to get a lousy 200 dollars a month?

This is one stupid idea.

I want compensation for my degree in life taken and heart breakin. If you want more money for 4-8 years of keg stands and hittin the bong then go somewhere else.

I want compensation for my degree in life taken and heart breakin. If you want more money for 4-8 years of keg stands and hittin the bong then go somewhere else.

Spoken like a true dumbass devil dawg. Are you just jealous that you wasted 4 years getting drunk banging dudes (whom you thought were chicks) while in port in Bangkok? :? By the way, it's "life takin' and heart breakin'."

Why not just give everyone a 3% increase for every year of service. I would not care what you called me then.

Time in Class is what it needs to be. Do your time in the class and be rewarded, why does everyone want a hand out, the reality is do your job in that class, do the time in that class and get the reward. A degree is great but it's not experience in class no matter how high one see's their self worth because of a degree it's not experience in class.

TIME IN GRADE TIME IN GRADE imo it should be 4 or 5 yr increments for each step in grade..I like this idea it's a good thing for recognition among peers, stop bashing

I think this is an attempt to implement a step plan but they are attaching titles to the ranks to justify the increase. Something similar has been proposed for DL. Now that we are trust funded, it will be interesting to see if this is approved.

PREDICTION:

You will see this implemented, but you'll never see any money allocated for it. It will be touchy-feely, like getting a 20 year pin or certificate to put in a filing cabinet drawer at the station in case the janitor forgot to leave any spare toilet paper for the weekend crew. The legislators mindset right now is you are darn lucky to have a job. Don't forget that they voted overwhelmingly to take 2% of our salary from us. It was a done deal, had Crist not vetoed it at the last minute. How can you honestly believe that the state is going to allow any kind of raise right now? If there is spare money out there that we have, they will take it away from us and give it to some college professors. Those college folks are squalking like the worlds coming to an end. In California, they had to call out the riot police at UCLA. We just sit back quietly and take whatever crumbs that happen to fall from the dinner table.

PREDICTION:

You will see this implemented, but you'll never see any money allocated for it. It will be touchy-feely, like getting a 20 year pin or certificate to put in a filing cabinet drawer at the station in case the janitor forgot to leave any spare toilet paper for the weekend crew. The legislators mindset right now is you are darn lucky to have a job. Don't forget that they voted overwhelmingly to take 2% of our salary from us. It was a done deal, had Crist not vetoed it at the last minute. How can you honestly believe that the state is going to allow any kind of raise right now? If there is spare money out there that we have, they will take it away from us and give it to some college professors. Those college folks are squalking like the worlds coming to an end. In California, they had to call out the riot police at UCLA. We just sit back quietly and take whatever crumbs that happen to fall from the dinner table.

This is the most accurate post I have read in a long time. Remember the motto of the legislature - You are necessary but not important. If you think the legislature has any compassion for the fate of state employees (law enforcement) you really are delusional.

PREDICTION:

You will see this implemented, but you'll never see any money allocated for it. It will be touchy-feely, like getting a 20 year pin or certificate to put in a filing cabinet drawer at the station in case the janitor forgot to leave any spare toilet paper for the weekend crew. The legislators mindset right now is you are darn lucky to have a job. Don't forget that they voted overwhelmingly to take 2% of our salary from us. It was a done deal, had Crist not vetoed it at the last minute. How can you honestly believe that the state is going to allow any kind of raise right now? If there is spare money out there that we have, they will take it away from us and give it to some college professors. Those college folks are squalking like the worlds coming to an end. In California, they had to call out the riot police at UCLA. We just sit back quietly and take whatever crumbs that happen to fall from the dinner table.

This is the most accurate post I have read in a long time. Remember the motto of the legislature - You are necessary but not important. If you think the legislature has any compassion for the fate of state employees (law enforcement) you really are delusional.


So true. That 2% deal made me sick to my stomach. I can't believe they even thought of that idea. It really opened up my eyes to how much Tallahassee really cares about us. People thinking we are getting raises anytime soon need to WAKE UP!

Please stop mixing apples and oranges here, this is about rank and tenure in rank, you have college ? great your compensated for that and it has nothing to do with this. Just because you have a degree in whatever, that does not justify handing over a tenure rank you did not earn so please move your discussion on college to another thread since it has nothing to do with this. This is exactly how a good thing gets messed up by putting too much baggage on. I agree get money for your degree, no arguement here, just move your discussion out of this thread, TENURE, TIME IN GRADE thats what the ranks are about.

I'm supposed to be excited that I get $80 per month for having a Bachelor's Degree or higher? That money comes out of the Trust Funds, not FHP. Every officer with a degree gets that money regardless of which agency they work for. That is not a benefit bestowed upon us by FHP. That $80 per month over the course of my career won't even touch how much it cost for me to go to college.

I worked hard to get through college while working a full time job. I wish there were online courses back then. I'm sorry, but someone has been watching too many movies if you think it's all about keg parties. I went to one and that was the day of graduation. And why is it that just because you go to college, you automatically have no street smarts? I'm afraid that's just a sorry attempt to make you feel better about yourself because you were too lazy to pursue a higher education. Don't whine and complain and say you were too poor or had a family to raise. Like I said, I worked a full time job and had to get loans to make it. It took at least 5 years past graduation before I had them paid off.

I'm not putting this out here because I think I deserve any pity. I joined FHP knowing that I would only get $80 per month for having a degree. I haven't expected anything else pay-wise. However, it would be nice to have my education considered on a resume, whether it be for promotion or for a specialty position. I'm getting off track here. What I wanted to get across is that most of us that hold real degrees from real universities worked hard to get them. I don't think I'm any better or automatically any smarter than anyone else that doesn't have a degree. But I do think that should there be a rank structure put into place, certain requirements should be exempted for those holding degrees from accredited universities. Remember that I said "certain requirements" not ALL of them should be exempted.

PREDICTION:

You will see this implemented, but you'll never see any money allocated for it. It will be touchy-feely, like getting a 20 year pin or certificate to put in a filing cabinet drawer at the station in case the janitor forgot to leave any spare toilet paper for the weekend crew. The legislators mindset right now is you are darn lucky to have a job. Don't forget that they voted overwhelmingly to take 2% of our salary from us. It was a done deal, had Crist not vetoed it at the last minute. How can you honestly believe that the state is going to allow any kind of raise right now? If there is spare money out there that we have, they will take it away from us and give it to some college professors. Those college folks are squalking like the worlds coming to an end. In California, they had to call out the riot police at UCLA. We just sit back quietly and take whatever crumbs that happen to fall from the dinner table.

This is the most accurate post I have read in a long time. Remember the motto of the legislature - You are necessary but not important. If you think the legislature has any compassion for the fate of state employees (law enforcement) you really are delusional.


So true. That 2% deal made me sick to my stomach. I can't believe they even thought of that idea. It really opened up my eyes to how much Tallahassee really cares about us. People thinking we are getting raises anytime soon need to WAKE UP!

That's why I scratch my head when these idiots go out and write 200 tickets a month? Why give all that money to this State and they give you crap back. Go out and make your stops but writing a warning and card aint going to kill you. Don't give in to this crappy state.

Some of u bright young go getters go get pictures of all the stripes and post them. I wana see how ccol I will look as a first sergeant.