Say No To BSO !!

The whole idea of outsourcing our specialized units to BSO, just to restore the proper staffing levels of patrol is crazy. I blame the city mangers and Brass for this problem.

I joined FLPD not BSO !!!

The whole idea of outsourcing our specialized units to BSO, just to restore the proper staffing levels of patrol is crazy. I blame the city mangers and Brass for this problem.

I joined FLPD not BSO !!!

I agree,,, I think we should go 100% to BSO. Patrol, Investigations and specialty units. It would be a step in the right direction. Give it some time "rook" you haven't been here long enough to know how bad i really is.

[Barak]

For those of you who mistakenly believe that BSO is the answer to the current situation we face, you are sadly mistaken. I mean no offense to our brothers & sisters who wear green & white but boys & girls, you ain't seen politics involved and ingrained in an agency until you've worked for a place where the agency head is an elected official.

It is true that our beloved agency is going thru some difficult times & leadership (or lack thereof) is definitely one of the issues affecting the direction of the agency. However, the idea of joining an agency that has been operating w/out a rudder for so long & by a corrupted official who has ruined the careers of so many fine LEO's, well suffice it to say that BSO has a long walk to get back on the path. Thankfully w/Lamberti at the helm, they have that opportunity- but BSO is not and never will be the answer for the FLPD or the city of Ft. Lauderdale.

Rumors of a BSO takeover or a county-type metro agency have floated around since I was a rookie waaaaay back when & it's never proven true. It will not this time either simply because of what the FLPD represents. Whether you understand it or not, the PD is a political entity. We are the most visible branch of local govt. & operate under the control of the city manager. As most of you know, he has own style- some would micro-managing- and there isn't a chance in heck he's gonna throw the agency over to BSO. If he did, he knows he would lose that level of authority & control. Just ask any city that turned their agency over to BSO; w/rare exception, the locals no longer are involved in priority decisions.

So forget about BSO. Instead put your time and efforts into fixing the place where you already work. If you can't do that, if you can't put aside your hurt feelings, perhaps it is time for you to consider other employment opportunities.

For those of you who mistakenly believe that BSO is the answer to the current situation we face, you are sadly mistaken. I mean no offense to our brothers & sisters who wear green & white but boys & girls, you ain't seen politics involved and ingrained in an agency until you've worked for a place where the agency head is an elected official.

It is true that our beloved agency is going thru some difficult times & leadership (or lack thereof) is definitely one of the issues affecting the direction of the agency. However, the idea of joining an agency that has been operating w/out a rudder for so long & by a corrupted official who has ruined the careers of so many fine LEO's, well suffice it to say that BSO has a long walk to get back on the path. Thankfully w/Lamberti at the helm, they have that opportunity- but BSO is not and never will be the answer for the FLPD or the city of Ft. Lauderdale.

Rumors of a BSO takeover or a county-type metro agency have floated around since I was a rookie waaaaay back when & it's never proven true. It will not this time either simply because of what the FLPD represents. Whether you understand it or not, the PD is a political entity. We are the most visible branch of local govt. & operate under the control of the city manager. As most of you know, he has own style- some would micro-managing- and there isn't a chance in heck he's gonna throw the agency over to BSO. If he did, he knows he would lose that level of authority & control. Just ask any city that turned their agency over to BSO; w/rare exception, the locals no longer are involved in priority decisions.

So forget about BSO. Instead put your time and efforts into fixing the place where you already work. If you can't do that, if you can't put aside your hurt feelings, perhaps it is time for you to consider other employment opportunities.
You are entitled to your opinion. I think you are wrong. It seems you are too emotionally invested in this place. I wanted a career in law enforcement which allows me to retire somewhat comfortably. Our pay and pension are a joke and I dont think the city has any intention of fixing that in time for many of our retirements. In my opinion and many others it is time we take a serious look at BSO. We all know the final decision does not rest with us, lets hope the city manager and commission make the right choice and seriously look at a merger.

[Barak]

You knew what the retirment package was when you got hired, just as I did. It hasn't changed much over the last 1/4 century except that it has gotten better for many of the newer folks when you consider that the retirement age dropped and the 5 year DROP was added. Those are both pretty good perks that didn't exist when I was hired.

Sure, I'd love to see a COLA added but I've known for years it wasn't part of the package & never expected it. That's why I've planned for the future. In addition to the pension, I've got DROP money accumulating and an ICMA account that I've been contributing to for nearly 2 decades. I also went & got myself an education so I'm marketable after I retire. That's planning for a comfortable retirement.

Our pay scale & bennies may not be at the top of the class but it's far from a joke. Go ask the local ditch digger how well he's doing and then compare that to what you do every day. you're entitled to your opinion but BSO is not the way. If you believe that, I'm sure they're hiring.

You knew what the retirment package was when you got hired, just as I did. It hasn't changed much over the last 1/4 century except that it has gotten better for many of the newer folks when you consider that the retirement age dropped and the 5 year DROP was added. Those are both pretty good perks that didn't exist when I was hired.

Sure, I'd love to see a COLA added but I've known for years it wasn't part of the package & never expected it. That's why I've planned for the future. In addition to the pension, I've got DROP money accumulating and an ICMA account that I've been contributing to for nearly 2 decades. I also went & got myself an education so I'm marketable after I retire. That's planning for a comfortable retirement.

Our pay scale & bennies may not be at the top of the class but it's far from a joke. Go ask the local ditch digger how well he's doing and then compare that to what you do every day. you're entitled to your opinion but BSO is not the way. If you believe that, I'm sure they're hiring.

You continually quote yourself stating the amount of time you have been a cop but then you compare our job to digging ditches. You are the very reason we are going to be buried in that ditch.

You knew what the retirment package was when you got hired, just as I did. It hasn't changed much over the last 1/4 century except that it has gotten better for many of the newer folks when you consider that the retirement age dropped and the 5 year DROP was added. Those are both pretty good perks that didn't exist when I was hired.

Sure, I'd love to see a COLA added but I've known for years it wasn't part of the package & never expected it. That's why I've planned for the future. In addition to the pension, I've got DROP money accumulating and an ICMA account that I've been contributing to for nearly 2 decades. I also went & got myself an education so I'm marketable after I retire. That's planning for a comfortable retirement.

Our pay scale & bennies may not be at the top of the class but it's far from a joke. Go ask the local ditch digger how well he's doing and then compare that to what you do every day. you're entitled to your opinion but BSO is not the way. If you believe that, I'm sure they're hiring.

Ok let me get this straight. If the salary when you started was 15 thousand a year and you obviously knew that, by your logic you should not complain if it doesnt go up.
Your salary and benefits are dictated by the market. We are at the bottom of this market area. Why?
Why dont you call the city manager and give him some pointers on negotiations? Sorry but it sounds as if you have no life and are only marred to this job and would proobably do it for half what your getting now.
Last time I paid an electrician it was $50 an hour. Plumber was more. No, I think I'll stay and fight the good fight. Great contract or BSO! Jack you have our support!

[Barak]

Again, you're missing my point. The FLPD should be more than competitive w/other other agencies in the county. As the central and most important city in the county, not to mention the busiest & w/the highest quality officers of any agency around, that should be recognized thru pay & bennies. Those points are certainly excellent recruiting tools to bring even more great folks to the agency. Ok, so right now we're not at the top so we've only got one place to go but up.

Listen, I'll never turn down a raise or an increase in bennies but it also wasn't the prime motivator that brought me here to the FLPD. My starting pay should be indicative of that. Shoot there were days way back when that I wasn't sure if I was going to have grocery money. Thankfully those days are long since gone but they certainly made me appreicate even more so what I have today.

I hope we get a good contract. I hope things work out for all of us but I also understand that's why they are called negotiations. All we can hope for is that everyone bargains in good faith & we can move on already.

My father was a union man some day I'll be one too.
The city wants our pension, what are we gonna do?
Come all you good workers good news to you I'll tell
Of how the good old union has come in here to dwell.

Which side are you on?

My daddy was copper and I'm a copper's son
and I'll stick with the union 'til every battles done.

Which side are you on?

They say in Ft. Lauderdale there are no neutrals there
you'll either be a union man or a thug for Dave Hebert

Which side are you on?

Oh workers can you stand it? Oh tell me how you can
Will you be a lousy scab or will you be a man?

Which side are you on?

Don't scab for the bosses don't listen to their lies
Us line cops haven't got a chance unless we organize.

Which side are you on?



(Does a champion give comfort to his brothers' enemy?)

My father was a union man some day I'll be one too.
The city wants our pension, what are we gonna do?
Come all you good workers good news to you I'll tell
Of how the good old union has come in here to dwell.

Which side are you on?

My daddy was copper and I'm a copper's son
and I'll stick with the union 'til every battles done.

Which side are you on?

They say in Ft. Lauderdale there are no neutrals there
you'll either be a union man or a thug for Dave Hebert

Which side are you on?

Oh workers can you stand it? Oh tell me how you can
Will you be a lousy scab or will you be a man?

Which side are you on?

Don't scab for the bosses don't listen to their lies
Us line cops haven't got a chance unless we organize.

Which side are you on?



(Does a champion give comfort to his brothers' enemy?)


AMEN BROTHER!

[Barak]

My father was a union man some day I'll be one too.
The city wants our pension, what are we gonna do?
Come all you good workers good news to you I'll tell
Of how the good old union has come in here to dwell.

Which side are you on?

My daddy was copper and I'm a copper's son
and I'll stick with the union 'til every battles done.

Which side are you on?

They say in Ft. Lauderdale there are no neutrals there
you'll either be a union man or a thug for Dave Hebert

Which side are you on?

Oh workers can you stand it? Oh tell me how you can
Will you be a lousy scab or will you be a man?

Which side are you on?

Don't scab for the bosses don't listen to their lies
Us line cops haven't got a chance unless we organize.

Which side are you on?



(Does a champion give comfort to his brothers' enemy?)

Wow, still not quite sure what your point is. You mean if I don't buy everything you're selling hook, line and sinker then I'm a scab? As I recall, I was hired as a police officer first and joined the union later. And I shouldn't listen to my boss because why? So if your sergeant asks you to handle something that the captain asked him to delegate, that means he's a scab too because all the "bosses" (whatever a boss is) are a bunch of liars? You've really lost me w/your logic. Didn't all the captains and lieutenants just unanimously vote down the city's contract offer too, shwoing their solidarity w/the officers and sergeants' union?

Even so, I've been a loyal dues-paying, marching, hanging door flyer member since probably most of you were still in daycare. I support the union's efforts, especially when it comes to contract negotiations time, but this talk about scabs and Hebert followers is completely out of place. Truthfully, how many loyal followers do you think Hebert has in our agency? I'm betting the # is less than 3. Remember, he's an appt. official & can be gone tomorrow. The minute you start throwing the term scab around, you're causing divisions w/in our own ranks & that benefits no one.

Wow, still not quite sure what your point is. You mean if I don't buy everything you're selling hook, line and sinker then I'm a scab? As I recall, I was hired as a police officer first and joined the union later. And I shouldn't listen to my boss because why? So if your sergeant asks you to handle something that the captain asked him to delegate, that means he's a scab too because all the "bosses" (whatever a boss is) are a bunch of liars? You've really lost me w/your logic. Didn't all the captains and lieutenants just unanimously vote down the city's contract offer too, shwoing their solidarity w/the officers and sergeants' union?

Even so, I've been a loyal dues-paying, marching, hanging door flyer member since probably most of you were still in daycare. I support the union's efforts, especially when it comes to contract negotiations time, but this talk about scabs and Hebert followers is completely out of place. Truthfully, how many loyal followers do you think Hebert has in our agency? I'm betting the # is less than 3. Remember, he's an appt. official & can be gone tomorrow. The minute you start throwing the term scab around, you're causing divisions w/in our own ranks & that benefits no one.

You're really not that dense. It's symbolic. Do I have to spell it out for you? This adaptation of the Florence Reese union rallying cry is just that: A rallying cry. This isn't 1930, and it's not Harlan County, Kentucky. We don't have scabs, but you do have to choose a side. ...and passivity is not the side of the union. Everyone knows who among the brass are on our side, and which ones are "the bosses."

My father was a union man some day I'll be one too.
The city wants our pension, what are we gonna do?
Come all you good workers good news to you I'll tell
Of how the good old union has come in here to dwell.

Which side are you on?

My daddy was copper and I'm a copper's son
and I'll stick with the union 'til every battles done.

Which side are you on?

They say in Ft. Lauderdale there are no neutrals there
you'll either be a union man or a thug for Dave Hebert

Which side are you on?

Oh workers can you stand it? Oh tell me how you can
Will you be a lousy scab or will you be a man?

Which side are you on?

Don't scab for the bosses don't listen to their lies
Us line cops haven't got a chance unless we organize.

Which side are you on?



(Does a champion give comfort to his brothers' enemy?)

Wow, still not quite sure what your point is. You mean if I don't buy everything you're selling hook, line and sinker then I'm a scab? As I recall, I was hired as a police officer first and joined the union later. And I shouldn't listen to my boss because why? So if your sergeant asks you to handle something that the captain asked him to delegate, that means he's a scab too because all the "bosses" (whatever a boss is) are a bunch of liars? You've really lost me w/your logic. Didn't all the captains and lieutenants just unanimously vote down the city's contract offer too, shwoing their solidarity w/the officers and sergeants' union?

Even so, I've been a loyal dues-paying, marching, hanging door flyer member since probably most of you were still in daycare. I support the union's efforts, especially when it comes to contract negotiations time, but this talk about scabs and Hebert followers is completely out of place. Truthfully, how many loyal followers do you think Hebert has in our agency? I'm betting the # is less than 3. Remember, he's an appt. official & can be gone tomorrow. The minute you start throwing the term scab around, you're causing divisions w/in our own ranks & that benefits no one.

I think they area trying to say SHUT UP ON HERE. No one thinks they can change your mind.

i hear more and more people ready to go to bso right now

Do you not get it or what. BSO what. What do you hear?? Oh we are going to go to BSO. Do you have a clue how it works? Why dont you go ??

The chances of the county taking over are slim to none. George likes his *****es in dark blue not white and green. He’s been pimping his bottom *****es for several years now and he likes them the way they are.

The chances of the county taking over are slim to none. George likes his *****es in dark blue not white and green. He’s been pimping his bottom *****es for several years now and he likes them the way they are.

Typical city...Always want to control the police

Gretsas and the commission are going to continue to piss all over us until we finally vote no confidence! YES TO BSO!

It is rediculous to say that new hires knew what all the benfits were before being hired!

COLAS, a new cop is just happy to get a job before he finds out what that is in conjunction with the rest of the benifit package.

Not long after being on the job and treated like a liability instead of an asset, the new hire begins to think about his benifits.

Then he/she is disapointed to realize that all the other agencies have better benifits and rates of pay, and much better treatment too! Due to current circumstances, our new hires are finding this information out within a year, when just a few years ago when the agency was run well, it might have taken about 3-5 years to become informed.

Hence why all are new hires are fleeing as fast as the door will rotate now!

So again, don't state crap like we all knew the benefits when we were hired so we can't complain now. Most do not!

[Barak]

It is rediculous to say that new hires knew what all the benfits were before being hired!

COLAS, a new cop is just happy to get a job before he finds out what that is in conjunction with the rest of the benifit package.

Not long after being on the job and treated like a liability instead of an asset, the new hire begins to think about his benifits.

Then he/she is disapointed to realize that all the other agencies have better benifits and rates of pay, and much better treatment too! Due to current circumstances, our new hires are finding this information out within a year, when just a few years ago when the agency was run well, it might have taken about 3-5 years to become informed.

Hence why all are new hires are fleeing as fast as the door will rotate now!

So again, don't state crap like we all knew the benefits when we were hired so we can't complain now. Most do not!


If you didn't read the fine print when you got hired, if you didn't ask those questions before you signed on the dotted line, that's your fault, no one elses. The fact that you were young, inexperienced and/or stupid is no one's fault but yours. If you're that convinced that Agency XX is so much better & aren't willing to fight what should rightfully be ours so that we are comparable or better compensated than other local agencies, then go sign up w/them--- and make sure you read thru their fine print first too!

If you didn't read the fine print when you got hired, if you didn't ask those questions before you signed on the dotted line, that's your fault, no one elses. The fact that you were young, inexperienced and/or stupid is no one's fault but yours. If you're that convinced that Agency XX is so much better & aren't willing to fight what should rightfully be ours so that we are comparable or better compensated than other local agencies, then go sign up w/them--- and make sure you read thru their fine print first too!

Wow... You really think a recruit is able to uncover what it's like to work for a PD without actually working there? I did more than my fair share of research before I applied, but I still wasn't told of the micromanagement from above, or that in a few years, the city would be trying to wheedle away our pension. I guess none of the guys & gals I talked to had the balls you do, Barak. Maybe when you got hired, years and years ago, this was a kick-ass department with support from city management, and you got lucky. Or maybe you're just smarter than the rest of us.

Enough with all the back-biting. We're in a quandary that will soon make us the 1980's Cleveland Indians of policework -- a training ground for new recruits who leave in a few years for greener pastures. Unless we stick together. We all have to do our part, and realize that though you might disagree with your brother/sister, it's us against them.

Solidarity

Barak you try to sound so smart and worldly on this site but everyone knows that you are just a legend in your own mind. Nobody is impressed with your"years and years" on the job or the tough talk about what we should have known when we got hired. Read our recruiting ad and then tell me is that the "paradise" we are working in. This form is a place to vent to each other and come up with useful information and solutions. You use it as a place to stand up on your soap box and proclaim that you have all the answers and have been through it before. I have taken the time to talk to guys youong and old and they all without the exception of you have said that this is the worst it has ever been. The contract problems of the 90's were just that contract and financial. The problems today are so systemic and deep that it is a different kind of war. Not only are we not compensated at the rate of our peers but we are suffering from an opressive hostile leadership. We are micromanaged and second guessed. We are disciplined and belittled. We are under equipped and poorly organized.
Barak, you are part of the problem. The constant "I have been here longer and I suffer worse than you" or "you should have known what you were getting before you got here".

Not trying to initiate more conflict than is already apparent on this site, but can someone describe where the micromanagement is, more so, on what level and what manner? Thanks

Not trying to initiate more conflict than is already apparent on this site, but can someone describe where the micromanagement is, more so, on what level and what manner? Thanks

If you have to ask then obviously you do not work here. Thanks for stopping by.

[Barak]

Pitt & Mcnulty do make a valid point or two, at least in regards to the micromanagement aspect of the PD. Since the current city manager took over & installed his group of less than qualified asst. city managers, ever aspect of everything we do is checked and double-checked by senior management ranks. This has increased the paperwork that needs to be generated from the officer & on up thru the sergeants, lieutenants & captains ranks.

The PD isn't alone in being micro-managed; so is the fire dept., public works, parks & rec, et al. We're just the most vocal about it because, historically & only up until the last 4 or so years, the PD has been generally been unaffected by the political meanderings of the elected and appointed officials.

Now Mr Pitt & Jim,
It pains me to know that you guys don't like my responses. Really I might lose an extra nanosecond of sleep tonite, especially since you think I'm part of the problem. I find that humorus cuz the way I see it, I think guys like you w/attitudes like yours are the problem. See this is one of the major differences between the folks of my generation and those that came after me. My gen was glad to have a job & would've done it for free if necessary if it meant keeping the job. During the contract conflicts back in the 90's we had sergeants willing to be demoted to save some officers from termination. Think that would happen today?

The generations that have followed mine had significantly different motivations, mostly self centered ones & the most recent generations have been the worst. Just look at the young officers running around w/the cell phone plugged into their ear the whole shift. How eactly are you doing the job if you're so focused on talking to your girlfriend/boyfriend all shift?

I think we were also more mature when we came on the job so yes, I knew what my pension future was cuz I asked & I still contend it's better now than it was when I got hired. Sure, I'd LOVE to get a COLA but w/the way the city has repsonded to that request, I ain't counting on it.

It's not that I'm smarter- it's just that I've been around long enough to better understand how the politics or these situations will work out. For those who think there are greener pastures, I wish them the best but I've seen far too frequently that the grass is most often not any greener once you get there. Some newbie just left today for Miami Gardens- oh yeah a real paradise. See ya after twenty years of working in that toilet.

You're right Jim in that we must be unified; at least we send a message of strength but that doesn't necessarily guarantee of us victory. And please, hold the rhetoric on the "war" we're fighting; it ain't a war- we're just trying to get compensated in parity w/other agencies.

So far I haven't heard any brilliant suggestions from any of you all how to make things better other than complain. All I'm trying to do is provide a different perspective other than telling the world how poorly we've been treated. I'll admit we're going thru some rough times right now, but tough times don't ever last- tough people do though.

[Copper]

So far I haven't heard any brilliant suggestions from any of you all how to make things better other than complain. All I'm trying to do is provide a different perspective other than telling the world how poorly we've been treated. I'll admit we're going thru some rough times right now, but tough times don't ever last- tough people do though.

Listen, I got no beef with you. But you haven't provided any solutions either, you post redundant page long comments that lead no where. You're solution is "wait it out", eventually (days, months or year?) things will level out. An apathetic attitude is almost as bad as a *****y one.

[Barak]

You're right so here's my suggestion-

Go to work every day, be as professional as you can possibly be w/the public, work as hard & as smart as you can w/the limited resources at your disposal. Prove to the citizens why we deserve to be in the upper tiers of compensation. Don't run around complaining to them while you're working a call about the current situation- that is not the time or place.

Support the union's efforts. So far, Jack & co.'s efforts have been very reasonable, rational & have not offended the public. Show up at meetings, marches, protests, hang door flyers if asked to do so & make phone calls. So long as no one advocates violating any ethical codes or breaking any laws, we'll still hold the high moral ground in our fight.

After that, there really isn't much more to do other than let the process and our negotiators work thru the process. We still may not come out on the winning end but at least we did our best and stayed PROFESSIONAL.

Here we go again. The typical Barak answer and post. Listen to me I am Barak and I have been doing this longer and better than anyone. You have offered no solution. And we have already shown why we deserve to be the TOP compensated agency not just the top tier. We have gone out and busted our butts, worked with dangerously low manpower, have performed with outdated and innefficient equipment, we have as the chief said "bucked the trend" in crime reduction and have put up with a city government that doesn't care. And FYI Barak, we have not quit on the citizens and nobody on here is saying we should. But the citizens should here why it takes 3 hours to respond to their emergency. They should here why we can't do efficient investigations because our department won't invest in the hardware that other agencies already have. They should here that their case will not even be looked at because there aren't enough detectives. They should here that there aren't more than 2 or 3 officers patrolling a huge section and not enough to routinely check their streets. They should here that we are not fairly compensated for what we do. You say it is not the time and place but you aren't the one facing these citizens. They need to know and NOW is the time and NOW is the place.
And FYI I have over 15 years in this business and I have seen highs and lows and this is the worst its been.

:roll:

[Barak]

Ok, well gee whiz I guess I must be wrong. Go whine some more to the public and see what that get's you. I wish you the best of luck.

[Barak]

I'm sorry, I apologize. That was just plain rude. So I've given you my ideas but haven't heard any from you all yet--- what are yours?

[Insp. Callahan]

Ladies & Gentlemen, Allow me to make a brief statement on your page.

I'm a Deputy at BSO and would like to ask that you LISTEN TO BARAK! Maybe now with an actual LEO as Sheriff things will improve around here, but wait and see. I know things are very bad at FLPD but they're even worse here at BSO. I was around FLPD in the early & mid 80's (non-sworn) and would have given a body part to have worked there (but that's a very long story for another time).

I've been a Dep. for around 18 years. When BARAK say's it's political over here, he's telling the truth. The only way to move up or around at BSO is the old, "Who ya know and who ya _ _ _ _". Everything from specialized units to promotions is done that way. We're fighting (?) in our current negotiations for the rule of 3 or 5 for promotions. Practically every article in our contract ends with, "...or at the sole discretion of the Sheriff.". The only thing greener over here is the pants guys. I believe what you need is a new city manager (I know, easer said than done). Once that happens, I'll bet things will start looking up. If you don't believe me, find an old Pompano Cop. That's all we hear is the way Pompano used to do it. No offense intended but every time we take over another city, BSO changes into a new entity. This is not the agency I applied to and wanted to work for.

For both our sakes, Please look long and hard into this before you make your decision. Just because you come over, doesn’t mean all or most of your troubles won't come over too.

Appreciate the post Harry but Barak is an idiot. He only comes to this site to spout off about how much experience he has and blah blah blah. And no offense but we have officers working in BSO that recently left here and believe me they are happier. You don't know the crap we are going through here. Bad faith negotiations by the city are just the tip of the iceberg. Poor moral from a total lack of leadership from the brass, poor moral from dangerous manpower shortages, poor moral from the belittling and berating for dots on the map, poor moral from lack of decent equipment, poor moral from micromanagement and etc etc.

We all know that the BSO has their problems but spare me the we have it worse than you routine. Nobody has it worse than us and if you don't believe it come pay us a visit and look at the total lack of hope we have for a positive change. And the who ya know and who ya blew still carries the day at our house too.

I'm sorry, I apologize. That was just plain rude. So I've given you my ideas but haven't heard any from you all yet--- what are yours?

Sorry Barak, your idea is to sit and wait and hope for the best because we are professional and some how you think that all of the sudden people will wake up and realize that and give us what we deserve? And how long do we wait? And having the feeling of pride from remaining professional will help feed my family somehow? Get off you soapbox Barak.

You want my solutions. We immediately resign all of our positions in specialty units to adequately staff patrol. We immediately begin negotiations with BSO for a complete takeover. We issue a national emergency alert to all travel organizations that our manpower is critically low and unsafe. We get with the Fire union and declare a vote of no confidence in the city manager and his cronies. The gauntlet has been thrown down and the gloves are off.

You may have been ill prpeared when you were hired to know that we deserve more for what we do and that the stress and turmoil on our lifes deserves top compensation but I was not.

-A champion doesn't sit and wait for victory to come to him. A champion picks up a weapon and fights .-

[Barak]

Wowie Debbie, I have to ask you if you think it's that bad, what are doing here? If you think I'm an idiot, what does that make you then? Queen of Idiotville? At least I see the potential in the future.

I have never denied there are problems here- matter, of fact, I've pointed out more than a few and agreed w/many others that we identified but nothing is insurmountable & like all other problems, these too will eventually go.

[Barak]

See that was just rude again. Name calling accomplishes nothing Debbie. My apologies. Perhaps we can proceed without resorting to such childish measures?

Pitt & Mcnulty do make a valid point or two, at least in regards to the micromanagement aspect of the PD. Since the current city manager took over & installed his group of less than qualified asst. city managers, ever aspect of everything we do is checked and double-checked by senior management ranks. This has increased the paperwork that needs to be generated from the officer & on up thru the sergeants, lieutenants & captains ranks.

The PD isn't alone in being micro-managed; so is the fire dept., public works, parks & rec, et al. We're just the most vocal about it because, historically & only up until the last 4 or so years, the PD has been generally been unaffected by the political meanderings of the elected and appointed officials.

Now Mr Pitt & Jim,
It pains me to know that you guys don't like my responses. Really I might lose an extra nanosecond of sleep tonite, especially since you think I'm part of the problem. I find that humorus cuz the way I see it, I think guys like you w/attitudes like yours are the problem. See this is one of the major differences between the folks of my generation and those that came after me. My gen was glad to have a job & would've done it for free if necessary if it meant keeping the job. During the contract conflicts back in the 90's we had sergeants willing to be demoted to save some officers from termination. Think that would happen today?

The generations that have followed mine had significantly different motivations, mostly self centered ones & the most recent generations have been the worst. Just look at the young officers running around w/the cell phone plugged into their ear the whole shift. How eactly are you doing the job if you're so focused on talking to your girlfriend/boyfriend all shift?

I think we were also more mature when we came on the job so yes, I knew what my pension future was cuz I asked & I still contend it's better now than it was when I got hired. Sure, I'd LOVE to get a COLA but w/the way the city has repsonded to that request, I ain't counting on it.

It's not that I'm smarter- it's just that I've been around long enough to better understand how the politics or these situations will work out. For those who think there are greener pastures, I wish them the best but I've seen far too frequently that the grass is most often not any greener once you get there. Some newbie just left today for Miami Gardens- oh yeah a real paradise. See ya after twenty years of working in that toilet.

You're right Jim in that we must be unified; at least we send a message of strength but that doesn't necessarily guarantee of us victory. And please, hold the rhetoric on the "war" we're fighting; it ain't a war- we're just trying to get compensated in parity w/other agencies.

So far I haven't heard any brilliant suggestions from any of you all how to make things better other than complain. All I'm trying to do is provide a different perspective other than telling the world how poorly we've been treated. I'll admit we're going thru some rough times right now, but tough times don't ever last- tough people do though.

Sorry Barak, your idea is to sit and wait and hope for the best because we are professional and some how you think that all of the sudden people will wake up and realize that and give us what we deserve? And how long do we wait? And having the feeling of pride from remaining professional will help feed my family somehow? Get off you soapbox Barak.

You want my solutions. We immediately resign all of our positions in specialty units to adequately staff patrol. We immediately begin negotiations with BSO for a complete takeover. We issue a national emergency alert to all travel organizations that our manpower is critically low and unsafe. We get with the Fire union and declare a vote of no confidence in the city manager and his cronies. The gauntlet has been thrown down and the gloves are off.

You may have been ill prpeared when you were hired to know that we deserve more for what we do and that the stress and turmoil on our lifes deserves top compensation but I was not.

-A champion doesn't sit and wait for victory to come to him. A champion picks up a weapon and fights .-

[Barak]

I'm sorry, I apologize. That was just plain rude. So I've given you my ideas but haven't heard any from you all yet--- what are yours?

Sorry Barak, your idea is to sit and wait and hope for the best because we are professional and some how you think that all of the sudden people will wake up and realize that and give us what we deserve? And how long do we wait? And having the feeling of pride from remaining professional will help feed my family somehow? Get off you soapbox Barak.

You want my solutions. We immediately resign all of our positions in specialty units to adequately staff patrol. We immediately begin negotiations with BSO for a complete takeover. We issue a national emergency alert to all travel organizations that our manpower is critically low and unsafe. We get with the Fire union and declare a vote of no confidence in the city manager and his cronies. The gauntlet has been thrown down and the gloves are off.

You may have been ill prpeared when you were hired to know that we deserve more for what we do and that the stress and turmoil on our lifes deserves top compensation but I was not.

-A champion doesn't sit and wait for victory to come to him. A champion picks up a weapon and fights .-

Oh yeah, that's brilliant- alarm the public, the folks that we are sworn to protect & let them know we can't do that- brilliant solution. Perhaps the national guard should be notified too. C'mon now, you've got to be brighter & more politically astute than that.

Actually, outside of that, you make a couple of valid points. A vote of no confidence towards the chief & the city manager might get us some public notice but probably accomplish little else other than peeve them off further. Not that I'd really care about that but I thought we were trying to find some middle ground where we could all agree on something, you know, like a contract! I fail to see how ano confidence vote would really help at this point, even tho I'd certainly vote for it.

I also agree w/your point about disbanding some of the specialty units. I'm not sure why, in this time of manpower crisis, we need 15 officers in TAC, 20 in Raiders, a CPI/SPI/CPU unit in every district along w/3 officers assigned to the vagrant squad, another in ecology crimes or whatever it is Mccoy is doing, plus the officers assigned to crime prevention or best yet, the officers assigned to admin spots like in IT. We could probably source up about 40 officers right there to bolster our numbers in patrol & get back to basics. 'Course then there's the 40 hr. block every year too- not like that's draining our manpower, right?

See, like it or not, we actually agree on a lot of things; our disagreement is how we get there.

[Barak]

Hey Callahan, thanks for your input but I suspect w/the group that's been posting here, it'll fall on deaf ears.

The public should be alarmed ! You don't get it. They are suffering as well. We can't provide adequate protection any longer. Maybe if we start embarrasing the city on a national stage they would realize how bad its gotten. But wait, your plan is to sit and negotiate because it has gotten so much ovet the past seven years. Barak come down off the ivory tower of yours. My family is the public and I want them to be alarmed so they know the risks of a city run amock.

And no offense but we have officers working in BSO that recently left here and believe me they are happier.

Don't forget, he too got a good deal because of who he knows.

[Insp. Callahan]

And no offense but we have officers working in BSO that recently left here and believe me they are happier.

Don't forget, he too got a good deal because of who he knows.

Referring to one of our newest Captains?
I remember him from way back, fairly decent guy now, I kind of like him. But there are questions about how/why he got here.
That's another big issue over here, all of the outside hires for high ranking positions. Morale is great over here too. :cry:

And no offense but we have officers working in BSO that recently left here and believe me they are happier.

Don't forget, he too got a good deal because of who he knows.

Referring to one of our newest Captains?
I remember him from way back, fairly decent guy now, I kind of like him. But there are questions about how/why he got here.
That's another big issue over here, all of the outside hires for high ranking positions. Morale is great over here too. :cry:

JP was top notch at FLPD, and our management was too ignorant to notice. BSO took one of the best for us when he left, leaving our future a little darker. Your lucky to have him.

[Barak]

The public should be alarmed ! You don't get it. They are suffering as well. We can't provide adequate protection any longer. Maybe if we start embarrasing the city on a national stage they would realize how bad its gotten. But wait, your plan is to sit and negotiate because it has gotten so much ovet the past seven years. Barak come down off the ivory tower of yours. My family is the public and I want them to be alarmed so they know the risks of a city run amock.

Please, your immature response here is indicative of immense exaggeration & a true lack of understanding about law enforcement's position w/in society & govt. The city is not "amok" but your response is. The last thing an organization like the police should ever do is alarm the public- that accomplishes nothing other than instilling fear that we can't or aren't doing our jobs and I'd never admit that, even if we could only put one officer out on the road per shift. You think the public doesn't already know how shorthanded we are on the road? You think the Union hasn't presented accurate data and schedules to the homeowners groups so they're aware? Grow up for chrissakes and try to understand and recognize the political aspect of this conflict.

http://www.sunrisefl.gov/documents/Poli ... 62004P.pdf (http://www.sunrisefl.gov/documents/PoliceOfcCert_62004P.pdf)

The public should be alarmed ! You don't get it. They are suffering as well. We can't provide adequate protection any longer. Maybe if we start embarrasing the city on a national stage they would realize how bad its gotten. But wait, your plan is to sit and negotiate because it has gotten so much ovet the past seven years. Barak come down off the ivory tower of yours. My family is the public and I want them to be alarmed so they know the risks of a city run amock.

Please, your immature response here is indicative of immense exaggeration & a true lack of understanding about law enforcement's position w/in society & govt. The city is not "amok" but your response is. The last thing an organization like the police should ever do is alarm the public- that accomplishes nothing other than instilling fear that we can't or aren't doing our jobs and I'd never admit that, even if we could only put one officer out on the road per shift. You think the public doesn't already know how shorthanded we are on the road? You think the Union hasn't presented accurate data and schedules to the homeowners groups so they're aware? Grow up for chrissakes and try to understand and recognize the political aspect of this conflict.

I must agree with a previous comment; Barak, you are truly a legend in your own mind. I might add you appear to be a tool (maybe unwittingly) of the current administration. Your repeated counsel to stay the course is exactly what the administration, both police and city, hope for. You pontificate to other posters as though your years on the department
grant you insight; longevity doesn't guarantee wisdom. I have a long time invested in this department myself, as do many people. I haven't commented on this sight before (you seem to comment enough for several people), however, I do read the site frequently and I've noticed every poster except "Insp. Callahan" is irritated by your comments, tone, or both. That doesn't automatically mean you're wrong, however, consider this. If you are among a group of people leaving a location, all heading for another, and during transit you find yourself alone, then it is probably you that has taken the wrong turn, not everyone else. It's true the posts here do not necessarily reflect the attitudes and opinions of
everyone in the department, however, it's all we have right here and the jury is in; you are an insufferable windbag.

[Copper]

So very well-said.

[Barak]

Believe me, I stayed away from this site as long as I could. I desperately avoided posting here because as far as I can tell, the majority of the folks that have posted here are either malcontents or whiny gen x/y/next gen ittle cry babies. But there's plenty of officers out there who share my thoughts & feelings- they just don't want to waste their time trying to rationalize or discuss this stuff w/you all because as I've found out, you all don't want to listen anyway. Your minds are already made up. My cohorts are tired of it because as far as some of us are concerned, the only people you seem to care about is yourselves. Well that ain't why I became a cop.

Here's another difference between my generation and the following generations of cops. My generation felt being in police work was a calling, like becoming a preacher, teacher, nurse or doctor. The succeeding generations look at this occupation more so as just a job, a place to earn some $$ & spend 40 hrs. a week. Perhaps if some of you folks would've gone thru the hardships me and my generation went thru, you'd have a greater appreciation for it.

I have never said we don't deserve a great contract & at least have parity w/other agencies in the area of near equal size. I just think we need to get to that point w/a different strategy than most of you folks do. Keep whining and posting your "feel sorry for me" angry comments & see how much public support that garners you.

Believe me, I stayed away from this site as long as I could. I desperately avoided posting here because as far as I can tell, the majority of the folks that have posted here are either malcontents or whiny gen x/y/next gen ittle cry babies. But there's plenty of officers out there who share my thoughts & feelings- they just don't want to waste their time trying to rationalize or discuss this stuff w/you all because as I've found out, you all don't want to listen anyway. Your minds are already made up. My cohorts are tired of it because as far as some of us are concerned, the only people you seem to care about is yourselves. Well that ain't why I became a cop.

Here's another difference between my generation and the following generations of cops. My generation felt being in police work was a calling, like becoming a preacher, teacher, nurse or doctor. The succeeding generations look at this occupation more so as just a job, a place to earn some $$ & spend 40 hrs. a week. Perhaps if some of you folks would've gone thru the hardships me and my generation went thru, you'd have a greater appreciation for it.

I have never said we don't deserve a great contract & at least have parity w/other agencies in the area of near equal size. I just think we need to get to that point w/a different strategy than most of you folks do. Keep whining and posting your "feel sorry for me" angry comments & see how much public support that garners you.


Public support only takes us so far, and we are past that point. It is now time to use the methods available to succeed. Again, you wax philosophical about your generation. Do you really think you and "your" generation went through something different than other officers on the department? How incredibly conceited. I probably am your generation, and from what I can see you are alone. If police work is your life then you are even more sad than you present yourself. You need to grow up. This is a job, exactly as you said. This is a means to support yourself and your loved ones. This job should finance your life, not become your life. You are on your way down the same road as Duffy et. al.

[Copper]

Believe me, I stayed away from this site as long as I could. I desperately avoided posting here because as far as I can tell, the majority of the folks that have posted here are either malcontents or whiny gen x/y/next gen ittle cry babies. But there's plenty of officers out there who share my thoughts & feelings- they just don't want to waste their time trying to rationalize or discuss this stuff w/you all because as I've found out, you all don't want to listen anyway. Your minds are already made up. My cohorts are tired of it because as far as some of us are concerned, the only people you seem to care about is yourselves. Well that ain't why I became a cop.

Here's another difference between my generation and the following generations of cops. My generation felt being in police work was a calling, like becoming a preacher, teacher, nurse or doctor. The succeeding generations look at this occupation more so as just a job, a place to earn some $$ & spend 40 hrs. a week. Perhaps if some of you folks would've gone thru the hardships me and my generation went thru, you'd have a greater appreciation for it.

I have never said we don't deserve a great contract & at least have parity w/other agencies in the area of near equal size. I just think we need to get to that point w/a different strategy than most of you folks do. Keep whining and posting your "feel sorry for me" angry comments & see how much public support that garners you.

You keep referring to the "new" generation as whiny and only out for themselves. How do you figure that? Who else are we supposed to be "out for": the city? the admin?
In fact if the new generation was only out for themselves, we would have told the old guys like you to piss off, taken the 5/5/5 and jumped into the FRS when we switch over, thus giving the "new guys" everything that the old guys are fighting for (cola). And with the number of new officers in this department, I bet we could have won a vote if we truly only cared about ourselves, like you continually state.
I applaud the new generation of officers for actually taking a stand and backing the union with support and voicing their discontent with the department despite the consequences. We know that if we stand together there's nothing they can do to us.
So you know what, I take offense to your narrow minded, self-centered comments, as you try to split this department in half by separating "generations" when the fact is, we're all cops. I had no beef with you, but I do now. I won't lump everyone with over XX years on as a scab because of your actions (or inactions) so I suggest you do the same. You are in the vast minority and you need accept that fact. I will never tell you not to voice your opinions, but expect the replies when you do.

Barak says,
Blah, blah, blah...I've been here longer...blah, blah, blah...the younger generation sucks...blah, blah, blah...I worked here with the Indians... blah, blah, blah...I am the best cop ever to walk the halls of FLPD...blah, blah, blah, I would do this job for free...blah, blah, blah...Aren't you tired of these lazy slugs who never even fired a wheel gun?...blah, blah, blah...my hemorrhoids are killing me...blah, blah, blah...We should be paid the best, BUT be happy with what you get!...blah, blah, blah...I love my giant annoying EGO...blah, blah, blah...Why does it smell like a fart evey time I start speaking?...blah, blah, blah...You all are a bunch of whiners and my generation never whined because tears hadn't been invented yet...blah, blah, blah...

You're king of the castle Barak....You giant blowhard!! :lol:

"Hashbrowns are better crispy than soggy"

[Barak]

Ah, brilliant comments all. You guys have convinced me finally w/your sheer intellect and power of reasoning.

Good luck fellas because w/your attitudes, you're gonna need it for a loooong career.

BSO looks better and better everyday. Just look at the utter lack of respect that the city has shown us over the past 3 1/2 years. And then to cancel the negotiation session today when they know the current state of moral going into the holidays. I know BSO has their issues but nothing is as bad as the current management of our department. Its either time for them to go or for us to go. Gretsas, Roberts, Hebert and the entire commission need to go.

Gretsas, Roberts, Hebert and the entire commission need to go.

Yeah and where do you subjects they go???......... Holiday Inn Express..

Please ever heard of bottom *****es,,, yeah buddy that’s us!!!!!

For those of you who mistakenly believe that BSO is the answer to the current situation we face, you are sadly mistaken. I mean no offense to our brothers & sisters who wear green & white but boys & girls, you ain't seen politics involved and ingrained in an agency until you've worked for a place where the agency head is an elected official.

It is true that our beloved agency is going thru some difficult times & leadership (or lack thereof) is definitely one of the issues affecting the direction of the agency. However, the idea of joining an agency that has been operating w/out a rudder for so long & by a corrupted official who has ruined the careers of so many fine LEO's, well suffice it to say that BSO has a long walk to get back on the path. Thankfully w/Lamberti at the helm, they have that opportunity- but BSO is not and never will be the answer for the FLPD or the city of Ft. Lauderdale.

Rumors of a BSO takeover or a county-type metro agency have floated around since I was a rookie waaaaay back when & it's never proven true. It will not this time either simply because of what the FLPD represents. Whether you understand it or not, the PD is a political entity. We are the most visible branch of local govt. & operate under the control of the city manager. As most of you know, he has own style- some would micro-managing- and there isn't a chance in heck he's gonna throw the agency over to BSO. If he did, he knows he would lose that level of authority & control. Just ask any city that turned their agency over to BSO; w/rare exception, the locals no longer are involved in priority decisions.

So forget about BSO. Instead put your time and efforts into fixing the place where you already work. If you can't do that, if you can't put aside your hurt feelings, perhaps it is time for you to consider other employment opportunities.
You are entitled to your opinion. I think you are wrong. It seems you are too emotionally invested in this place. I wanted a career in law enforcement which allows me to retire somewhat comfortably. Our pay and pension are a joke and I dont think the city has any intention of fixing that in time for many of our retirements. In my opinion and many others it is time we take a serious look at BSO. We all know the final decision does not rest with us, lets hope the city manager and commission make the right choice and seriously look at a merger.

If you are looking for a career in Law Enforcement, hen Id ake a serious look at how you define that term. At BSO Law enforcement is all politics and image. Lately, it seems like a law enforcement team but it took how many officers getting shot? At that organization you can be a person who practices law enforcement from the ethical standpoint (Like catching bad guys for instance.) And then you can wonder everyday why IA, your sgt, or some other dvision or individual above you is so far up your you know what. You can also count down the days before your thrown into some crazy write up or IA nvestigaton and lose your job along with the possibility of ever obtaining another. OR....you can be a yes man...do as your told.....only do a minimum of work....and be left alone......and sometimes honored as a fabulous employee! These are your options. I know, Ive been there. At BSO, the mre yuo work, the worse they make your life. Perhaps you have the same thing over there. But if your looking for something better..like a job in "law enforcement"...then my advice is look elsewhere. If our looking or a pension and an easy job, then BSO is the place to go. They like it when you dont talk back. But you should also know that there are more police in Fort Lauderdale than there are admin. Which technically gives the PD the power if they use it. Even if that isnt true, is admin going to hit the streets if the PD were to bail? I dont think so......

So before you make a rash decision, consider this option to turn around FLPD before voting to make the switch.....this is just a suggestion now, but what do you have to lose...right?

Take them on a field trip!!!!!! A tour of their own city!!!!! This woud be a tour for anyone having an admistrative or other position that makes budget decisons and/or recommendations regarding law enforcement in the city of Fort Lauderdale.
First.......you should have a big open picnic in Holiday Park. Invite all the homeless. Make sure they get to see all the crack, heroin and coke whores taking care of business...dont forget to explain that this is one of the places that has helped put Broward County at one of the top slots for so many new HIV/Aids cases.....they'll love it because they love being number one. Show them the business and sales section where the drug dealers and loan sharks negotiate and shoot the whores who dont pay up, give them the opportunity to extend their clean and pristine hand out to help a bloody, vomiting, Disease riddled crack whore up off the ground and over to the road to recovery...and dont forget to explain the "bottom line" concepts and accounting procedures of how these shootings sometimes happen over amounts that are really big like say $80.00 when the debt is super high..they'll be able to relate to that.....given their extensive financial backgrounds) And just for fun...take a walk to the fields so they can get a nice view of some serious pornographic action.

after that..... offer a horse drawn open top carriage ride down sistrunk and throw US1 in as a bonus. (make sure to give them inside tours of the crack houses and meth labs, and explain to them why all those guys in dark clothing are riding around on bicycles in the middle of the night. Make it real interesting, get involved with the locals there, ask for an interactive lesson on how to shoot up with a heroin needle or create a homemade crakpipe.... mingle....., interact....give them a tour using that "Sunsational Service" they so love)....but tell them you'll have your uniform on but you wont be bringing your gun, handcuffs, or any other item that could be misconstrued as a threat or show of force by all those good felony committing and lawsuit loving residents. Also advise they cannot hire any security, carry weapons, or bring translators because you want to portray a more approachable and friendly image to the people you represent and serve. (Keep referring to the guidelines of "Sunsational Service..).

Then Tell them if they make it through that field trip alive and/or mentally intact....then maybe youll at least give them the benefit of hearing out their silly budget and safety ideas (Which they nothing about because they are all lawyers and car salesmen tpe people that live in glass houses and throw stones).

Once your done there...please take that same project over to BSO. Id love nothing more than to see those commissioners have to fear for their life while bearing witness to what they should be blamed for creating.

So my point? If you move to or merge with BSO.....youll get a lateral move at best....so why waste your time? Have a nice day!

While you may not agree with everything Mr. Barak has to say, It would certainly be in YOUR best interest to take note of a few facts. THE GRASS IS NOT ALWAYS GREENER SOMEPLACE ELSE! The wind changes very often in our profession. You don't have any idea the internal politics that takes place at BSO, no matter who you talk to over there.
True, while you do not contribute to the State Pension and they do have a 3% COLA for retirees, let me point out some very important facts about our pension. During the Enron fiasco the FRS (Fla Retirement System) lost hundreds of millions of dollars, our pension lost $50,000.00. I truly believe our plan in managed much better that the State. The police and firefighters govern our pension, we have the controlling votes for ALL disabilty claims, service or non service related. We have a built in life insurance plan for service and non service related deaths. Four times your annual salary, for line of duty deaths this is in additon to the State and Federal benefits. You work at FLPD for 9 1/2 years and get fired, under FRS you get NOTHING, at FLPD you at least get your contribution plus simple interest back to help you get by until you get another job.
You become disabled off the job, painting your house, riding bulls, racing, scuba diving or whatever hobby you may have or are strickened with cancer, with FRS you get NOTHING, at FLPD you get 55% for the rest of your life and the option for your spouse to receive benfits after you die.
You are disabled on the job, FRS Workers Comp, when you die nothing! At FLPD 65% tax free for the rest of your life, when you die, spousal benefits and the option for her or him to stay in our FOP Group Health Plan. At BSO spouses cannot remain in the County Plan! In either case the Pension Board wants you to remain on the job at full pay even if it is a light duty position, hence you still receive your raises and are able to retire with a full pension. At BSO they dump you as soon as they can.
Need I say more. These are very real tragedies that have befallen our brother and sisters over the years. There is more to the job than a quick fix pay raise. You have families that depend on you even if you are disabled. Now granted, my pension is guaranteed even if you go green and white, until the very last retiree or spouse is dead. FLPD has a very proud tradition even in tough political times, you will all prevail as long as you remain united behind your FOP leaders. Don't let the nay-sayers and mal-contents ruin it for you and your families.
SEMPER FI

While you may not agree with everything Mr. Barak has to say, It would certainly be in YOUR best interest to take note of a few facts. THE GRASS IS NOT ALWAYS GREENER SOMEPLACE ELSE! The wind changes very often in our profession. You don't have any idea the internal politics that takes place at BSO, no matter who you talk to over there.
True, while you do not contribute to the State Pension and they do have a 3% COLA for retirees, let me point out some very important facts about our pension. During the Enron fiasco the FRS (Fla Retirement System) lost hundreds of millions of dollars, our pension lost $50,000.00. I truly believe our plan in managed much better that the State. The police and firefighters govern our pension, we have the controlling votes for ALL disabilty claims, service or non service related. We have a built in life insurance plan for service and non service related deaths. Four times your annual salary, for line of duty deaths this is in additon to the State and Federal benefits. You work at FLPD for 9 1/2 years and get fired, under FRS you get NOTHING, at FLPD you at least get your contribution plus simple interest back to help you get by until you get another job.
You become disabled off the job, painting your house, riding bulls, racing, scuba diving or whatever hobby you may have or are strickened with cancer, with FRS you get NOTHING, at FLPD you get 55% for the rest of your life and the option for your spouse to receive benfits after you die.
You are disabled on the job, FRS Workers Comp, when you die nothing! At FLPD 65% tax free for the rest of your life, when you die, spousal benefits and the option for her or him to stay in our FOP Group Health Plan. At BSO spouses cannot remain in the County Plan! In either case the Pension Board wants you to remain on the job at full pay even if it is a light duty position, hence you still receive your raises and are able to retire with a full pension. At BSO they dump you as soon as they can.
Need I say more. These are very real tragedies that have befallen our brother and sisters over the years. There is more to the job than a quick fix pay raise. You have families that depend on you even if you are disabled. Now granted, my pension is guaranteed even if you go green and white, until the very last retiree or spouse is dead. FLPD has a very proud tradition even in tough political times, you will all prevail as long as you remain united behind your FOP leaders. Don't let the nay-sayers and mal-contents ruin it for you and your families.
SEMPER FI

I never heard so much BS coming from a single person. If you are going to give numbers and facts, do some homework because you sound like a complete idiot. I switched to green and it was the best choice I ever made.

So just to point out some of your nonsense, if you get fired under FRS, as long as you have 6 years, you are vested and will get 18% of your retirement. This is pending you don’t have a serious crime like a Felony where your pension could be taken from you. FLPD is 10 years to vest. As for enron, the FRS didn’t lose money, the people who decided to opt for the FRS investment option lost money in the stocks, but most who were there then and still there now are easily going to retire with million in investments that can be given to their family if something happens to them in the line of duty.

I’m not sure where you gathered your information, however if you are injured in the line of duty, the FRS covers 65%. If you are injured off-duty it also covers 65% it’s an FRS special risk for those who are police officers and fire fighters. Now the minimum says 25% for regular retirement for off-duty jobs, special risk is always 65%. http://www.rol.frs.state.fl.us/myfrs/fo ... pp_spd.pdf (http://www.rol.frs.state.fl.us/myfrs/forms/pdf/frs_pp_spd.pdf)

In the line of duty disability is available to FRS the first day, FLPD has to wait 91 days.

http://www.ftlaudpfpension.com/content/view/15/42/1/6/

At the SO if I’m injured, my wife and children can remain in an HMO covered for life.

Our survivor benefits give my wife 50% of my salary if I’m killed in the line of duty. The agency will pay according to contract, which for our agency is 4 times your salary. There are also benefit options that will cover your family for life under the FRS. It’s all in the above link.

Please stop with your BS non-sense about how good you think you have it. The FRS gives better money and better benefits. While some things may be better at the city pension, overall FRS is better.

By the way learn how to spell

While you may not agree with everything Mr. Barak has to say, It would certainly be in YOUR best interest to take note of a few facts. THE GRASS IS NOT ALWAYS GREENER SOMEPLACE ELSE! The wind changes very often in our profession. You don't have any idea the internal politics that takes place at BSO, no matter who you talk to over there.
True, while you do not contribute to the State Pension and they do have a 3% COLA for retirees, let me point out some very important facts about our pension. During the Enron fiasco the FRS (Fla Retirement System) lost hundreds of millions of dollars, our pension lost $50,000.00. I truly believe our plan in managed much better that the State. The police and firefighters govern our pension, we have the controlling votes for ALL disabilty claims, service or non service related. We have a built in life insurance plan for service and non service related deaths. Four times your annual salary, for line of duty deaths this is in additon to the State and Federal benefits. You work at FLPD for 9 1/2 years and get fired, under FRS you get NOTHING, at FLPD you at least get your contribution plus simple interest back to help you get by until you get another job.
You become disabled off the job, painting your house, riding bulls, racing, scuba diving or whatever hobby you may have or are strickened with cancer, with FRS you get NOTHING, at FLPD you get 55% for the rest of your life and the option for your spouse to receive benfits after you die.
You are disabled on the job, FRS Workers Comp, when you die nothing! At FLPD 65% tax free for the rest of your life, when you die, spousal benefits and the option for her or him to stay in our FOP Group Health Plan. At BSO spouses cannot remain in the County Plan! In either case the Pension Board wants you to remain on the job at full pay even if it is a light duty position, hence you still receive your raises and are able to retire with a full pension. At BSO they dump you as soon as they can.
Need I say more. These are very real tragedies that have befallen our brother and sisters over the years. There is more to the job than a quick fix pay raise. You have families that depend on you even if you are disabled. Now granted, my pension is guaranteed even if you go green and white, until the very last retiree or spouse is dead. FLPD has a very proud tradition even in tough political times, you will all prevail as long as you remain united behind your FOP leaders. Don't let the nay-sayers and mal-contents ruin it for you and your families.
SEMPER FI

I never heard so much BS coming from a single person. If you are going to give numbers and facts, do some homework because you sound like a complete idiot. I switched to green and it was the best choice I ever made.

So just to point out some of your nonsense, if you get fired under FRS, as long as you have 6 years, you are vested and will get 18% of your retirement. This is pending you don’t have a serious crime like a Felony where your pension could be taken from you. FLPD is 10 years to vest. As for enron, the FRS didn’t lose money, the people who decided to opt for the FRS investment option lost money in the stocks, but most who were there then and still there now are easily going to retire with million in investments that can be given to their family if something happens to them in the line of duty.

I’m not sure where you gathered your information, however if you are injured in the line of duty, the FRS covers 65%. If you are injured off-duty it also covers 65% it’s an FRS special risk for those who are police officers and fire fighters. Now the minimum says 25% for regular retirement for off-duty jobs, special risk is always 65%. http://www.rol.frs.state.fl.us/myfrs/fo ... pp_spd.pdf (http://www.rol.frs.state.fl.us/myfrs/forms/pdf/frs_pp_spd.pdf)

In the line of duty disability is available to FRS the first day, FLPD has to wait 91 days.

http://www.ftlaudpfpension.com/content/view/15/42/1/6/

At the SO if I’m injured, my wife and children can remain in an HMO covered for life.

Our survivor benefits give my wife 50% of my salary if I’m killed in the line of duty. The agency will pay according to contract, which for our agency is 4 times your salary. There are also benefit options that will cover your family for life under the FRS. It’s all in the above link.

Please stop with your BS non-sense about how good you think you have it. The FRS gives better money and better benefits. While some things may be better at the city pension, overall FRS is better.

By the way learn how to spell

awesome. get into arguments with anonymous people on the internet. my pension is better than your pension. my department is better than your department. my dad can beat up your dad. how long does it take to write a post that long? go spend time with your kids, hug your wife/husband/girlfriend/boyfriend or get a hobby. all the posts on here aren't going to change reality or people's opinions.

...or you could spend time managing your investment account. Of course, people who know every detail of a pension plan rarely take their financial security in their own hands.

If this Florida State Pension information is true, this needs to be addressed at the next meeting since some facts were told to the members at past meetings which may not be correct.

If this Florida State Pension information is true, this needs to be addressed at the next meeting since some facts were told to the members at past meetings which may not be correct.

Read the link FRS provided. The information is there and accurate. The greatest thing is not contributing and where I work we have the FRS so we contribute on our own to a 457 or 401. To top it off the agency gives us a 457H which at the end of your retirement all your sick time and vacation, holiday comp and comp money is placed in this account so you are covered for life. There are things with the FRS that need to be improved, but overall is very good. Many cities are struggling with their pensions and is probably why Miami Gardens went with FRS. Stay safe out there.

FRS = FOOLS RETIREMENT SYSTEM

If this Florida State Pension information is true, this needs to be addressed at the next meeting since some facts were told to the members at past meetings which may not be correct.

Read the link FRS provided. The information is there and accurate. The greatest thing is not contributing and where I work we have the FRS so we contribute on our own to a 457 or 401. To top it off the agency gives us a 457H which at the end of your retirement all your sick time and vacation, holiday comp and comp money is placed in this account so you are covered for life. There are things with the FRS that need to be improved, but overall is very good. Many cities are struggling with their pensions and is probably why Miami Gardens went with FRS. Stay safe out there.

yea, and if the state of florida decides to do away with the FRS, which they have discussed on several occasions then bye bye pension. all we need is a cola and our pension will be tops. why not fight to change that one little thing instead of revamping our whole retirement system. yes, let's reinvent the wheel.

As far as the 457, we have that option open to us.

if you guys want the FRS so badly go apply to a pd that has one. i'm convinced that most of the posters on here aren't happy unless they are complaining about something.

I'd wager that if the city gave us a 6 figure contract, a bag of gold every year, and keep its nose out of the pd's affairs people would still complain.

"Wah, why does it have to be a bag full of gold. It hurts my back. Gold is heavy. Other department get bonus checks. Why can't we get bonus checks? Bags of gold, what is this 15 century England?"

If this Florida State Pension information is true, this needs to be addressed at the next meeting since some facts were told to the members at past meetings which may not be correct.

Read the link FRS provided. The information is there and accurate. The greatest thing is not contributing and where I work we have the FRS so we contribute on our own to a 457 or 401. To top it off the agency gives us a 457H which at the end of your retirement all your sick time and vacation, holiday comp and comp money is placed in this account so you are covered for life. There are things with the FRS that need to be improved, but overall is very good. Many cities are struggling with their pensions and is probably why Miami Gardens went with FRS. Stay safe out there.


yea, and if the state of florida decides to do away with the FRS, which they have discussed on several occasions then bye bye pension. all we need is a cola and our pension will be tops. why not fight to change that one little thing instead of revamping our whole retirement system. yes, let's reinvent the wheel.

As far as the 457, we have that option open to us.

if you guys want the FRS so badly go apply to a pd that has one. i'm convinced that most of the posters on here aren't happy unless they are complaining about something.

I'd wager that if the city gave us a 6 figure contract, a bag of gold every year, and keep its nose out of the pd's affairs people would still complain.

"Wah, why does it have to be a bag full of gold. It hurts my back. Gold is heavy. Other department get bonus checks. Why can't we get bonus checks? Bags of gold, what is this 15 century England?"

Yea, but you guys already contribute. I choose to put 10% into a separate 401K and my 457 money is given to us at retirement.

The information about doing away with the FRS, is bogus and wrong. There have been talks of cities such as Boca going to a 401k, but again, it's only talks. Read Tampa's forum, they are constantly messing with their pension. Boynton Beach had city leaders misusing their funds and the same with Lake Worth. Pembroke Pines was in the paper saying how much it cost them for their pension. Pension cost money, and just about every place throws around the idea of a 401k or doing away with pensions. Let's face it, one day in Florida no one will have a pension.

To the misinformed poster talking about a Fools retirement system, the only fool I noticed if who ever made the comment. The FRS is the second most stable pension in the nation. Is there room for improvement? Sure, same with Fort Lauderdale.

It's not about who's better, we all can improve in some area. I agree with you some will never be satisfied. We have one of the best contracts around, and we still have people complain. Stay safe and as far as I'm concerned, we are all family.

I contribute to the 457 as well. If you plan properly for retirement you should be fine. If you are relying on your pension alone you are stupid. People need to take control of their financial future and not rely on their employer to do it for them.

People are going to have their opinions about the FRS versus the private retirement system. This is the worst most counter productive place to discuss them because it won't change a thing. I just like getting on here to read the nonsense. You see, its like the equivalent to monkeys throwing feces at each other. It never really accomplishes anything, but its really funny to watch.


"Can I dip his Yoo Hoo in gold?"

[JimmyMcNulty]

I contribute to the 457 as well. If you plan properly for retirement you should be fine. If you are relying on your pension alone you are stupid. People need to take control of their financial future and not rely on their employer to do it for them.

People are going to have their opinions about the FRS versus the private retirement system. This is the worst most counter productive place to discuss them because it won't change a thing. I just like getting on here to read the nonsense. You see, its like the equivalent to monkeys throwing feces at each other. It never really accomplishes anything, but its really funny to watch.

"Can I dip his Yoo Hoo in gold?"
I couldn't agree with you more. We're getting the opportunity to let our money grow tax free in mutual funds that are closed to the general public. If you're not taking advantage of that, you're insane. If that tree-hugger hippie Gore is right, the city will be underwater by the time the new guys retire anyway, so ya better have a backup plan!

I, for one, am not relying on the city's benevolence or our ability to negotiate without binding arbitration. I contribute an additional 12% of my pay into the 457, so I know I'll be fine no matter what. The option is open to all of you. It just takes discipline. Hmm... new boat now, or make six figures after retirement?

We still deserve and need a better pension, if only to attract cops who want to spend a career here. If we don't have competitive pay & bennies, we'll continue to have a tough time hiring good people. But you gotta take matters into your own hands.