09-21-2007, 08:44 PM
I was only getting one side of the story here on LEOAFFAIRS.COM, but I guess that just shows you how easily we can be fooled by non-disclosure. Chip this is your website, you plan on quitting in six years, you can't work the street, and I am sure this post will be deleted before it even sees another's monitor. With these facts, how could anyone trust you to tell us the truth and not your own personal agenda? I read the other site takebackyourpba.com and only wondered if your 100 day plan would be as effective as the Democrats last 100 day plan? Am I better off going with you and having the worse PBA representation ever? or staying with people who won't need a training course, who actually have used the PBA in their favor with positive results.
I copied the following from WCFPBA.ORG and it made me realize the conflict of interests your side has and the obvious bias. MAKE THIS A STICKY.
I am sure I will get flamed, my grammar will be wrong, misspelled something. Anything to get off topic.
I like making more money, these last two contracts were fine with me, I will retire one day - and like to live large and not working part time or Reserve to make ends meet. I have kids, I can't put their future in the hands of your personal, childish drama.
FACT, FICTION or JUST PLAIN DRAMA:
“They don’t boo nobodies” –Reggie Jackson, famous Yankees slugger.
FACT: When you are an incumbent, your accomplishments are a matter of record. It is also a FACT that criticism goes with the territory of any elected position.
FACT, FICTION or JUST PLAIN DRAMA: The following information is pulled from fingers hitting keyboards somewhere: Putting facts forward is important, putting slanted, incorrect or misleading information out is unfortunate (for everyone). Putting information in cyberspace doesn’t make it factual either. So decide for yourself if you are getting FACT, FICTION, or JUST PLAIN DRAMA.
FACT: On Sept. 16, 2007, Greg Stout posted on LeoAffairs.com that “We have not received a Badge and Labor union newspaper in over one year. We now receive something resembling a sixth grade quality printing press production.”
FACT: The old styled Badge & Labor cost about $1,500 - $2,000 to print and mail. The FACT is the new style PBA news bulletin costs around $75 - $100 to print.
FACT: In April 2003, Greg Stout authored an article for the Badge and Labor, stating in part “I took on the position of Editor of the Badge & Labor. One of our goals is to see that this paper is published on a monthly basis with news and information that is helpful to the entire membership.”
FACT: In January 2004, nine months later, Greg Stout, then the 2nd Vice President of the PBA, authored another article for the Badge and Labor. In his article he mentioned that it was “our first publication of the Badge & Labor since July of last year”. Greg explained how events were happening rapidly, and would have been outdated by the time it went to print. The FACT remains that we went without a Badge & Labor for five months.
I understand what Greg had been saying as editor. I also was present in my assignment as President. Now it’s election time… FACT, FICTION, or JUST PLAIN DRAMA?
FACT: The PBA, this past spring, obtained the in-house capability to produce our own newsletter, which dramatically cut down on the cost.
FACT: Since that time, the PBA has dispersed a news bulletin for a fraction of what the old Badge & Labor costs, and it has been distributed each month. Examine it for yourself. The new style bulletin works well and is very cost-effective.
FACT: Since July 4, 2007, Greg Stout has been calling for the elimination of the President’s stipend, or salary. From July 4th until Sept. 15th, the course of two months, he never mentioned that he received a stipend while he had been the 2nd Vice-President of the PBA. Furthermore, he also enjoyed the benefit of earning overtime while working at TPD. The full-time positions of the officers serving at the PBA DO NOT accrue overtime, and do not have the opportunity to accrue 300 hours of overtime for pension purposes. That loss stays with you forever.
FACT: Only after Greg Stout’s stipend payments were revealed during a 9/15/07 roll call did he acknowledge the payments. (Source: Greg Stout, 9/16/07)
What happened to that information during those two months? Only Durkin’s stipend was inappropriate? The FACT is Stout’s stipend status was withheld from our membership. We can’t account for what motivated Greg to remain silent on that until it was brought out.
FACT: Greg Stout, Pat Lynch, Jim Meier and Chip DeBlock have all taken part in their writings on Leoaffairs.com. You can evaluate it for yourself.
FACT: In the accompanying Jan. 2004 Newsletter, Greg Stout compares the format that made Leoaffairs.com famous as “no different from scrawling graffiti on a bathroom wall”. He was right about pseudonyms, anonymity and outright lies, insults and libelous slurs against other officers. He was correct then…Now it’s election time. Also in the same article, Greg Stout emphasized the “audacity” of a TPD officer who accused us, the Board, of acting “unethically” when we voted in two new board members to fill vacancies, in the same manner that the board voted Greg in as 2nd Vice President. The FACT is, to receive audacious slurs, insults and misrepresentations apparently just go with the territory of elected people.
Take the time to read Greg Stout's views printed straight out of the Badge and Labor, January 2004 Edition:
THE STATE OF OUR UNION
By Greg Stout, Second Vice President
The year 2003 has been filled with immense success for the West Central Florida PBA. This is our first publication of the Badge & Labor newspaper since July of last year. A lot of you have asked “Why?”, and the simple answer is that so many things were happening so rapidly that by the time the news went to print it would have been outdated when it reached you, the reader.
I had a lot of time to ponder over the content of this article. I could have written about our new contract that included some of the best benefits I have enjoyed since being at the Tampa Police Department; or, our new pension benefit where we took promises and thin air and turned them into a 3.15% multiplier. Simply translated, the reward for twenty years of service went from fifty percent of your pay to sixty-three percent just like that. But the magnitude of great achievement was significantly diminished by a very small group of Tampa police officers this year.
I like open, honest dialog with anyone. I enjoy spirited debate. It is a good thing when people educate themselves about pressing issues in the police department, but when did it become okay to openly attack other police officers and our union? When are poor manners and outright lies acceptable to you? I can only speak about my personal observations, but my immediate answer is that it is NEVER acceptable. Who’s to blame for this breech of civility? It would be very easy to say it’s those younger cops with a couple of years on, but veteran cops are also guilty. Let me give you a couple of examples: When friends of mine approached me in the oddest places, bathrooms, elevators, stairwells, etc. and began their opening remarks with, “Nothing personal,” I began to twinge, because the next sentence was usually filled with some venomous statement that included things like “I better get every bit of the pension multiplier I was promised or somebody will be sorry.” How about this one: “Nothing personal, but you guys at the PBA should have gotten us at least a ten percent pay raise this year.” I could go on repeating incredible things said to me or about me, but I won’t.
At a recent PBA Board of Directors meeting, a Tampa officer had the naked audacity to accuse our board of acting “unethically,” when we voted in our two newest members. That officer even insisted that we admit our guilt and publish an apology in The Badge & Labor for all to
see. To make matters worse, that officer filed this written complaint the very week that we were in final negotiations with the city on our contract and pension multiplier. His actions forced us to stop what we were doing, consult legal counsel for an opinion, and finally turn his complaint over to the State PBA for a ruling; all of which cost hundreds of your dollars in legal fees and took our attention away from the important business at hand. He approached me in the PBA parking lot after the meeting and wanted to let me know this was “nothing personal.” Of course we were acting ethically and properly, and that was the conclusion of our local attorneys and the state PBA attorney.
As if this face-to-face acrimony isn’t enough for you, we have an electronic bulletin board at our disposal now where any officer can hide behind a pseudonym and anonymously post outright lies and insulting, libelous slurs against other police officers, the PBA, retired officers, officers from other agencies and our own staff. In my opinion, the actions of those few are no different from scrawling graffiti on a bathroom wall.
When we malign fellow officers, we literally tear down our positive accomplishments. We truly are a fraternity. We spend nights, weekends and holidays together. We dance at our weddings and we hold on to each other at our funerals. We are a family and we should hold that honor with all the respect it deserves.
We should be filled with pride when we speak about our police department. We really are the best agency in the Southeastern United States and maybe even further. If you don’t believe me, ask someone who has worked as a police officer elsewhere. They have a totally different perspective of working conditions here. I know I do.
Nothing personal, but stop the assault on your union and on your brother and sister officers.
I copied the following from WCFPBA.ORG and it made me realize the conflict of interests your side has and the obvious bias. MAKE THIS A STICKY.
I am sure I will get flamed, my grammar will be wrong, misspelled something. Anything to get off topic.
I like making more money, these last two contracts were fine with me, I will retire one day - and like to live large and not working part time or Reserve to make ends meet. I have kids, I can't put their future in the hands of your personal, childish drama.
FACT, FICTION or JUST PLAIN DRAMA:
“They don’t boo nobodies” –Reggie Jackson, famous Yankees slugger.
FACT: When you are an incumbent, your accomplishments are a matter of record. It is also a FACT that criticism goes with the territory of any elected position.
FACT, FICTION or JUST PLAIN DRAMA: The following information is pulled from fingers hitting keyboards somewhere: Putting facts forward is important, putting slanted, incorrect or misleading information out is unfortunate (for everyone). Putting information in cyberspace doesn’t make it factual either. So decide for yourself if you are getting FACT, FICTION, or JUST PLAIN DRAMA.
FACT: On Sept. 16, 2007, Greg Stout posted on LeoAffairs.com that “We have not received a Badge and Labor union newspaper in over one year. We now receive something resembling a sixth grade quality printing press production.”
FACT: The old styled Badge & Labor cost about $1,500 - $2,000 to print and mail. The FACT is the new style PBA news bulletin costs around $75 - $100 to print.
FACT: In April 2003, Greg Stout authored an article for the Badge and Labor, stating in part “I took on the position of Editor of the Badge & Labor. One of our goals is to see that this paper is published on a monthly basis with news and information that is helpful to the entire membership.”
FACT: In January 2004, nine months later, Greg Stout, then the 2nd Vice President of the PBA, authored another article for the Badge and Labor. In his article he mentioned that it was “our first publication of the Badge & Labor since July of last year”. Greg explained how events were happening rapidly, and would have been outdated by the time it went to print. The FACT remains that we went without a Badge & Labor for five months.
I understand what Greg had been saying as editor. I also was present in my assignment as President. Now it’s election time… FACT, FICTION, or JUST PLAIN DRAMA?
FACT: The PBA, this past spring, obtained the in-house capability to produce our own newsletter, which dramatically cut down on the cost.
FACT: Since that time, the PBA has dispersed a news bulletin for a fraction of what the old Badge & Labor costs, and it has been distributed each month. Examine it for yourself. The new style bulletin works well and is very cost-effective.
FACT: Since July 4, 2007, Greg Stout has been calling for the elimination of the President’s stipend, or salary. From July 4th until Sept. 15th, the course of two months, he never mentioned that he received a stipend while he had been the 2nd Vice-President of the PBA. Furthermore, he also enjoyed the benefit of earning overtime while working at TPD. The full-time positions of the officers serving at the PBA DO NOT accrue overtime, and do not have the opportunity to accrue 300 hours of overtime for pension purposes. That loss stays with you forever.
FACT: Only after Greg Stout’s stipend payments were revealed during a 9/15/07 roll call did he acknowledge the payments. (Source: Greg Stout, 9/16/07)
What happened to that information during those two months? Only Durkin’s stipend was inappropriate? The FACT is Stout’s stipend status was withheld from our membership. We can’t account for what motivated Greg to remain silent on that until it was brought out.
FACT: Greg Stout, Pat Lynch, Jim Meier and Chip DeBlock have all taken part in their writings on Leoaffairs.com. You can evaluate it for yourself.
FACT: In the accompanying Jan. 2004 Newsletter, Greg Stout compares the format that made Leoaffairs.com famous as “no different from scrawling graffiti on a bathroom wall”. He was right about pseudonyms, anonymity and outright lies, insults and libelous slurs against other officers. He was correct then…Now it’s election time. Also in the same article, Greg Stout emphasized the “audacity” of a TPD officer who accused us, the Board, of acting “unethically” when we voted in two new board members to fill vacancies, in the same manner that the board voted Greg in as 2nd Vice President. The FACT is, to receive audacious slurs, insults and misrepresentations apparently just go with the territory of elected people.
Take the time to read Greg Stout's views printed straight out of the Badge and Labor, January 2004 Edition:
THE STATE OF OUR UNION
By Greg Stout, Second Vice President
The year 2003 has been filled with immense success for the West Central Florida PBA. This is our first publication of the Badge & Labor newspaper since July of last year. A lot of you have asked “Why?”, and the simple answer is that so many things were happening so rapidly that by the time the news went to print it would have been outdated when it reached you, the reader.
I had a lot of time to ponder over the content of this article. I could have written about our new contract that included some of the best benefits I have enjoyed since being at the Tampa Police Department; or, our new pension benefit where we took promises and thin air and turned them into a 3.15% multiplier. Simply translated, the reward for twenty years of service went from fifty percent of your pay to sixty-three percent just like that. But the magnitude of great achievement was significantly diminished by a very small group of Tampa police officers this year.
I like open, honest dialog with anyone. I enjoy spirited debate. It is a good thing when people educate themselves about pressing issues in the police department, but when did it become okay to openly attack other police officers and our union? When are poor manners and outright lies acceptable to you? I can only speak about my personal observations, but my immediate answer is that it is NEVER acceptable. Who’s to blame for this breech of civility? It would be very easy to say it’s those younger cops with a couple of years on, but veteran cops are also guilty. Let me give you a couple of examples: When friends of mine approached me in the oddest places, bathrooms, elevators, stairwells, etc. and began their opening remarks with, “Nothing personal,” I began to twinge, because the next sentence was usually filled with some venomous statement that included things like “I better get every bit of the pension multiplier I was promised or somebody will be sorry.” How about this one: “Nothing personal, but you guys at the PBA should have gotten us at least a ten percent pay raise this year.” I could go on repeating incredible things said to me or about me, but I won’t.
At a recent PBA Board of Directors meeting, a Tampa officer had the naked audacity to accuse our board of acting “unethically,” when we voted in our two newest members. That officer even insisted that we admit our guilt and publish an apology in The Badge & Labor for all to
see. To make matters worse, that officer filed this written complaint the very week that we were in final negotiations with the city on our contract and pension multiplier. His actions forced us to stop what we were doing, consult legal counsel for an opinion, and finally turn his complaint over to the State PBA for a ruling; all of which cost hundreds of your dollars in legal fees and took our attention away from the important business at hand. He approached me in the PBA parking lot after the meeting and wanted to let me know this was “nothing personal.” Of course we were acting ethically and properly, and that was the conclusion of our local attorneys and the state PBA attorney.
As if this face-to-face acrimony isn’t enough for you, we have an electronic bulletin board at our disposal now where any officer can hide behind a pseudonym and anonymously post outright lies and insulting, libelous slurs against other police officers, the PBA, retired officers, officers from other agencies and our own staff. In my opinion, the actions of those few are no different from scrawling graffiti on a bathroom wall.
When we malign fellow officers, we literally tear down our positive accomplishments. We truly are a fraternity. We spend nights, weekends and holidays together. We dance at our weddings and we hold on to each other at our funerals. We are a family and we should hold that honor with all the respect it deserves.
We should be filled with pride when we speak about our police department. We really are the best agency in the Southeastern United States and maybe even further. If you don’t believe me, ask someone who has worked as a police officer elsewhere. They have a totally different perspective of working conditions here. I know I do.
Nothing personal, but stop the assault on your union and on your brother and sister officers.