Negotiations Today

Today we received the City's financial package offer. Contained therein was a 0% general wage increase, a complete loss of uniform allowance and a loss of any accrued vacation time beyond 200 hours. The City merged the Step Increase with the Merit Increase paragraph which basically kept them the same. Bottom line is that the only "increase" in pay was the 2.5% "step increase" for those entitled and the "merit increase" to those topped out. In addition, the City also proposed to limit a person to remain at home if they called in sick and in order to take advantage of funeral leave, a requirement was proposed that the employee MUST attend the funeral service for it to be approved.

We will be having a meeting with officers and Sgt.s on Wednesday 7/18 at 9:00am to discuss the City's proposal for anyone who is interested. Contact Adam or Sgt. Hicks for the location.

Ken how did you keep from laughing in there face? Do they think we are ganna take that when they can spend millions on B.S train stations and big clocks at 49 and park? Hell I trade the Vic for an Impala if I can get a raise. Not like we chase anybody.

I agree the city offer is laughable but really, we need to come up with something better than the old train station and clock arguement to counter this offer. We are faced with having to overcome a perception that the city is a victim thanks to the state government tax rollbacks. Going back and saying that the reason we are not getting raises this year because of spending three budget years ago is not going to cut it.

We as cops are gonna talk tough but no one is going to actually do something about it. The man responsible for the city's failure will never called out by the union and we will lay down and take whatever they give us, we always do.

I am impressed with the FOP given the circumstances however nothing will change until the "Cartoon Tie Guy" is gone. Last contract the city pleaded poverty and claimed financial hardship. Two months after the contracts were signed, Cartoon Tie was given a large raise and was quoted in the Times on several occasions about how well off the city is. I say we should go after Cartoon Tie and hold him accountable for the city's failure to plan. Is he not in charge? where does the buck stop?

Honestly though we aren't gonna do a darn thing except fight more over OT. I think we should just end this whole stupid charade and let's get fitted for the green and white at least we'll be able to keep our take homes cars then.

As part of the negotiation team, let me just say that we hear the same type of rhetoric about being broke from all the cities. We hear the same thing whether times are good or whether times are bad. The last contract surely didn't pass because of the money that was put on the table. It passed with a slim margin because of other benefits such as the take-home car policy.

This time the City is claiming even more financial distress as a result of the recent legislative action. No doubt that every government organization that derives money from taxes will be affected. However, rolling back the millage rate, costly decorative expenditures and deferral of commercial tax obligations hasn't helped the City with its budget. With the projected increase in health insurance cost and the increase in the general cost of living, it is evident that employees would prospectively make less next year than last year should the City's proposal be accepted. I believe that the first priority of any City is to fairly compensate their employees before having the luxury of the spending monies on items that seem fiscally irresponsible, and you know what they are. We all are aware that without employees that believe in the City, the City would not be able to function. If we fall farther down the list in compensation compared to other agencies, its obvious that people will leave and we will be left with bottom-of-the-barrel type applicants, ones that we all don't want to work next to.

That said, remember, ratifying the contract is up to you. Once we receive the City's best and final offer, we will have a vote. The City said that they were not prepared to say that their initial offer was their best and final, so further negotiation will take place. As stated earlier, it would be nice to have input from people at the meeting next Wednesday at 9:00am. The next negotiation session is Friday, 11/20 at 1:00pm in the second floor conference room of City Hall.

Wrong date for negotiation, its 7/20 not 11/20.

Ok, so there trying to sell us on ZERO pay increase and 2.5% merit. You have got to be kidding me. Yet the guy telling us the city has no money, is driving a fancy SUV, wonder were he's getting the money to fill the tank. His wife must not work for the city.

I don't understand how we can go from one of the higher paid agencies to one of the lowest in approx. 4 years. If the city doesn’t want a police force, they need to just tell us. What they are doing is forcing officers to leave!!!! If they continue with the trend of higher paid supervisors, then who will be here to take calls?

We have many good supervisors but as in anything we have a few bad apples. Not saying that the pay is deserved but, who's taking the calls and providing the actual police service to the citizens??

To the negotiation team,

This if my proposal to the city.

30%, 50%, 50% pay increase.
I want a $2,000.00 clothing allowance even for patrol officers.
Take-home cars withing 200 miles with unlimited personal use.
No more health-insurance premiums.
Vacation bank to be extended to 600 hours with an accrual rate of 100 hours per month.
When I take sick time the city pays for it..period.
Comp-time bank extended to 400 with an accrual rate of 50 hours a month whether I work overtime or not.
and we get the 12 million dollar building that they promised us.

Since they are in the habit of BSing right from the start let's stand fast and join in the big joke. I certainly don't want to be the only one not laughing at the party.

Ii never wanted to leave this agency. I've been here 6 years and I love it here. But there is no way I will work for this. Everyone is going through it you say? well, maybe it's time to leave law enforcement all together. I have a family, and there is no way that I will work in this field with shoddy health insurance, no pay, no vacation, and not even be able to mourn my family when one of them passes. This is more than insulting. This is ridiculous.

I do not understand, how can the city claim they have no money. Maybe we should have the mayor look for a new city manager instead of "tie guy"

I can understand that the new "tax cuts" are affecting all cities. Yet our city continues to give "breaks" and annex.

I wonder what they are offering the fire fighters and even the public works guys.

We as a group need to standup against the city and demand better wages and benefits. I understand the price of health care is on the rise. We pay enough out of out pocket. Yet, when the bottom dollar leads us to believe we sometimes pay to work for the city.

As Ken said the city is nothing without its workers, namely the public safety professionals. The city and its citizens want a police an fire service they call their own. I would go out on a limb and state that the citizens want the "best" in these areas. Therefore money and benefits are what draw the "best" to our city's workforce.

Amazing how they say they have no money, but yet city hall is a very posh place to work. I wish the pd had the new carpet and designer tile as well as the adequate ventilation system. The pd even after the remodel looks like something from the 60's with the unique stale and musty smell through out the building.

We not asking for a miracle, just and adequate salary to provide for our families. I would venture to city the city manager does not have this issue and he doesn’t even have to put his life on the line.

This is the same game the city plays EVERY negotiation. They threaten to take ALL of our benefits away and then at "zulu hour" graciously let us have them back in exchange for a BS pay package. We are supposed to scurry away to our little holes happy that we have our 2%, or whatever, and whatever benefits we have always had. This game gets very tiring and you are surely going to loose a lot of senior guys.

I, like one of the posters before, have been here for over 7 years and have been very happy with the PD. But I WILL NOT work for a city that operates like this. Lots of things need to change from the top down. Maybe we do need a new City Manager. If a city doesn' t have money to pay it's employees a fair wage then it is NOT being properly "managed." If your police officers, good ones, are leaving for no other reason but pay and benefits, then your city is NOT being properly "managed."

If it is the "tie guy" then he needs to be held accountable. God forbid a citizen reports my car number for driving too fast, or complains that I was rude to them.....I am held accountable. Why should he not be?

A note to the Admin of the agency. Let me tell you this now....don't take it personal when I turn in my letter or anyone else does. Please do not have any henchmen try to "dirty us up" on the way out of the door as it is nothing personal and it has NOTHING to do with ANY one of you. Chief, Capt. Haworth, Capt. Green and Capt. Forseth, again....please do not feel like we don't know how hard you work for us. I, for one, just do not want to work for a city that does not share your way of thinking!

I mean, we are negotiating with an idiot that thinks that we do not need a pay raise becaue we are all going to benefit so much from the cut in property taxes. News flash John Moore.....I can find more change in my couch than some of us will save on our taxes next year. Obviously you do not know the specifics of the proposed tax plan or you would understand this.

I am with the other poster who said I will give up this BS take home Crown Vic that I can't use for anything anyway. You want to save money, fine, take your car and give me my raise! You want to save money? Do away with this S.P.O. program that is a complete FAILURE and give me my raise. We are acutually paying these guys 7% more to do less work and NOT take any calls. Not all, but most, as we have a couple of good ones and you know who they are.

I am just as anti-take over as the next guy, but I hate to agree with the other guy. If you don't want a PD, just get rid of the damn thing and gog out with style!

I disagree with the above poster on one account. I am not giving up my take home car. We shouldnt have to give up anything for a pay raise. All we are asking for is a pay package that is competitive with other agencies in the area.

And I don't think we should give up anything that they have asked for period..the city and the State cannot run without law enforcement. Neither can the city or any other place out here. This is a BS ploy to not payus. Ask any of the businesses that annex into here part of the reason is because of the great service provided by us and the FD..and the city knows it. So no, we don't back down..we don't give them anything..and we get what we deserve..period..

The friggin tax thing hasn't passed..it hasn't been resolved..there is no reason why we should be negotiating on what MIGHT happen..we rolled over three years ago and made the effor to work with the city. and this is how they come to us. Negative..you get nothing from me..

I owe this city nothing..I bust my ass day in and day out..I've been spat on, bled on, exposed to hep C, TB, and AIDS, been injured on the job, sick, punched, kicked, slapped, all for the city and it's citizens. I've cleaned piss and s--t out of the back of my car..and gone home covered with mud and sewage so that I can't even hug my kids when I got home. I have an electronic leash that I jump at whenever the city needs me..I've left my familie's birthdays to come and teach not just the police officers but CITY EMPLOYEES also.

All I ask, is competitive pay so i can raise my kids, and retire when my time is up. I have been here 6 years, been trained incredibly, been in a specialized position, and had no plans to go anywhere. But my main priority is my family. I love this job..I really really do..this is the best thing going and you guys are some of the best people I have ever known.. but I'm not gonna be taken for granted. I watched my dad put in 24 years with a major company just to be cut lose at the end..and I'm not gonna do it..I'm young, I have military experience, a college degree, and I've been awarded several times by the agency. I don't have to stay here..and I'll leave with a quickness.

Which reminds me of another point..If you look at the number of officers who have college degrees in this agency, we are the most educated department in the city..even more so then the folks who run the city. How do u like them apples?

https://www.fdle.state.fl.us/cjst/CJAP/index.html


Just some information, take a look

Sean you made all good points but unfortunately they have a rhyme or reason for everything and if they don't they'll make one up.

I agree with most of the last several posts, but remember we are not hitting the targeted audience. The city council, mayor, and the citzens of PP need to know how we feel and need to know what is happening. Those ofcs who live in city cannot show up at a city council meeting and complain (bad career move). We need to get the press involved and get citizens we trust to slam our points home at the council meetings. It's great to discuss these issues here, but without the info getting into the mainstream, the public will think we are just being greedy. Let's give them all the facts and let them decide. If we allow this city to ram a junk contract on us just for us to have a job, would not make sense. I would rather the SO take over and cut our losses, instead of accepting a garbage proposal.

As an eleven year officer at this agency I have been through several negotiations. As many of you know this is not the first time the city has said there is no money for us. I point out to you that 3 years ago some of you said yes to the city's contract offer. This did nothing for putting money in your pocket. Let us also remember that we as an agency lost our power to bring in good officers, because we fell to the middle of the of the pay scale in Pinellas County. Then we watched the rest of the agencies over the last three years get more money as we fell further back in the pack.

The city said through the FOP that they would make it up to us in the next contract (2007). The city now says there is no money for us. Let us remember that the city had no problem over the last three years reaping the rewards of the tax money that they were collecting over the last three years. Why was the money not invested, or put away for what the city knew was coming up this year. I have seen this city perform pay studies, and moral surveys, over the last several years and here we are again. Once again the city is taking away things we already have and they are making us fight to get things back that we aleady had. What kind of negotiations is this. The money the city offered to the FOP the other day we all know is a joke. Look into this people! Their offer will not even cover the cost of your health insurance increase. We raised the same argument 3 years ago about how much it cost for a person to live in the Tampa Bay area, (housing, insurance, gas). When do you as an officer and employee stand up and say enough is enough?

If you think that what the city is doing now is new, it is not. It is just another excuse for them. Put the city's mis-management on display and stand up through the FOP and tell the city we will not take this anymore. Stop the in fighting with each other and for once band together and let your voice be heard. Ken, Adam and Perry thank you for your hard work, but please don't let this continue.