John Sanders, you actually listened to the sheriff at the meetings and your statement of "cause" proves it. I applaud your attention span because normally he puts people to sleep with the overuse of his clichés. "Cause" can mean anything. "Just cause" is what the deputies unions wanted to be placed in the discipline policy. If his purpose for demotion, or discipline is sound, he shouldn't be worried about changing the term "for cause" to "for just cause." On the other hand, if he wants the ability to fire someone for political reasons, he would fear the term "for just cause." We only want everyone on a level playing field. Person A should be treated the same as person B if each committed the same violation. As it sets now, if person A is a supporter, nothing happens while person B gets disciplined.
The union also wanted GAP, but when the budget crisis started to rear it's head, the union pulled the proposal from their contract and changed the whole GAP issue to be a request from the sheriff on behalf of the deputies. In other words, we asked the sheriff to agree to ask the county to fund GAP for us like they do for the rest of the county. Thats right, the guy who cleans the floors and windows on county buildings gets GAP. Now if you don't like law enforcement officers, tell the county that your feel we do not deserve it.
Those are the two negotiation reasons why we reached an impasse. We already stated we could live without use of the mailboxes for union communications and he is aware of that even though numerous other agencies have that ability. In your opinion, should the deputies stand up for what we think is right? Or are we asking for too much? We want the word of the sheriff to be solid, believe me. More importantly, we want our policies to be the solid foundation of what guides us as they should. The sheriff has taken benefits away arbitrarily and changed policy that he didn't even follow to new policies he still doesn't follow and that is wrong.
Now to answer your questions.
How many people has Sheriff White demoted without cause?
There have been about 5 people disciplined for cause where there was no good reason. He effectively fired a deputy and violated his law enforcement bill of rights only to bring the deputy back because there is nothing to support the improper termination.
http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/may...t-with-deputy/ The deputy has had to file 2 lawsuits to preserve his rights because the only relief is in the courts. We just had 2 detectives reassigned to patrol positions for no reason other than "you are no longer who we desire in this position." Those reassignments come with a 5% pay cut. Add that to the wage freeze and that is huge for people raising children when they did nothing wrong and are not under investigation.
Has he ever went against the recommendation of the Appeals Board?
He has lost every ruling when the appeals board has convened and he clearly should have lost them. His influence with the times has greatly aided him in burying the rulings in the back pages and then accepting the fact that "the sheriff was not available for comment" for the remainder of time. He accepted the rulings because they would have clearly led to huge federal lawsuits over the ineffective investigations leading to the terminations and that would have been covered in a different section of the times that his friends in our local bureau can not control.
Didn't the Sheriff ask for your GAP insurance, even in these tight budgetary times because he knows what it means for you guys?
During negotiations, the sheriff refused to agree to ask the county commission to fund the GAP insurance which is all the union asked him to do. Then when the public became educated that EVERY other full time county employee gets that benefit, he realized he would look silly if he did not ask for it. It would have been transparent that he was continuing his pattern of violating federal law by employing union busting. We have had deputies attend mandatory meet the sheriff sessions over the last few months report back that the sheriff spent the majority of the time trying to pit them against the unions and gain their vote in his reelection. Several new deputies felt uncomfortable to be in the meetings and he was reported as telling them the county agreed to give him 2.5% for raises in this upcoming budget, but he declined it because the union demanded 5% raises. I assure you that this is a complete lie because the union and sheriff have not had negotiations at all concerning this upcoming budget. He has lied to these employees to serve himself. No wonder why you had a bad experience with a deputy. I would leave a meeting feeling pretty low if I didn't know better too. By the way, the FOP does not condone a deputy doing a crappy job because he represents all deputies out there and we are prideful in the work we do. If we weren't we wouldn't ask for better treatment and better conditions.
As a side note. Even though he asked for the county to fund GAP, he can take the money and tell the deputies to suck it and he can use the money for whatever he wants. We want it in a contract so he can not do that because yes, he can not be trusted to do the right thing.
What you should be concerned about is the fact that the county has GAP set so only the workers who stay 30 years will be eligible. It should be commensurate with your retirement class. Fire fighters and deputies normal retirement in the Florida retirement system is 25 years. If I as a county commissioner have them work an extra 5 years, I will spend more money to pay an employee a higher wage through years 25-30 than I would if I made GAP available at 25 years and they retired and a new 1st year employee filled their position. The cost for GAP per 25 year retiree each year would be less than the difference of a higher wage 30 year employee minus the lower wage of a new employee. You should really be asking the county and the sheriff about that waste!
Pasco Deputy Sheriff Wages
Starting pay= $17.82 per hour or $3,029.40 per month
30 year pay = approx $32.98 per hour or $5,606.60 per month
Difference in pay = approx 15.16 per hour or $2,577.20 per month
GAP IS WAY CHEAPER! GIVE THEM GAP AS INCENTIVE TO RETIRE AT 25 YEARS AND SAVE BIG $$$ I'm sure the Pasco Fire Fighter wages will be similar in differences and still can not believe the county didn't think to look at this closer!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mr. Sanders, I am neither disgruntled, nor a call sluffer. I think it sucks if your call for service was not handled within guidelines and according to the law as long as we had the legal authority to perform whatever service you asked of us. I am simply a member of the FOP and a member of one of the labor units and have given you honest answers to your questions based on information available to me. Wouldn't you kind of have to agree with me that all our elected officials have their heads up their behinds and have not been honest with us and lived up to their promises?
I can honestly say that if things don't change no matter who the sheriff is white, sullivan, bogart, or mickey mouse, you and I will be worse off. It will only be a matter of time before some drug addict or gang member sees us, our loved ones and our houses as appetizing targets for crime.
Originally Posted by fldeputy
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