The shotgun
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Thread: The shotgun

  1. #1
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    The shotgun

    The shotgun is such an antiquated and out date 1960's intimidation weapon for law enforcement, I wonder why so much money and training is spent on them? Personally I would never get a shot gun out and it to bring to any call, it is very awkward and heavy to carry around in any police shooter situation. I have lots of bullets in my pistol, I will never use that lugy 6 shot gun or use that sling to put it on me and slow me down in a shooting situation. This is especially true for females. For the money they spent on them, they could have purchased some decent light weight rifles for the officer to use in an active shooter situation. Just my 2 cents.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    The shotgun is such an antiquated and out date 1960's intimidation weapon for law enforcement, I wonder why so much money and training is spent on them? Personally I would never get a shot gun out and it to bring to any call, it is very awkward and heavy to carry around in any police shooter situation. I have lots of bullets in my pistol, I will never use that lugy 6 shot gun or use that sling to put it on me and slow me down in a shooting situation. This is especially true for females. For the money they spent on them, they could have purchased some decent light weight rifles for the officer to use in an active shooter situation. Just my 2 cents.
    F'In rookie.... I've carried a shotgun since the early 90's, and it is still a usefull tool today... When the $hit goes south, nothing wrong with playing some nine ball, with the bad guy... Rack'em up with the bigboys, or go home snowflake...

  3. #3
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    Exactly my point, "carried it since I was hired in the early 90's" and the BS taught in the academy, of rack the slide to intimidate people. That worked good in the 60's riots to scare people and was almost as good as water hoses, but is a joke now. We need to ditch the heavy lug around shot gun and all get trained on the lighter useful rife. It's a joke, instead of the worthless shotgun training we should all be practicing on the rifle for active shooter situations. It's not that hard friends.

  4. #4
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    The Shotgun training is a fake useless training of a weapon that no one would most likely use today in his/ her career that has been taught since the first police original organized police academy in 1968, but is forced training and not up to date with the times. Almost as bad as the ASP training you have to go through year after year, but no officer has ever used an ASP, even since the Rodney King beating by police with batons since 1991. Better tools have been invented and used since then ,i.e.., Chemical spray and Tasers.

  5. #5
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    All of the money spent on buying all those new shotguns, could have been spent on buying rifles and up to date training, instead of the old school training on those shotguns which will never be used in the line of duty and is repeat old school training.. Watch the Virginia Tech shooter videos, even the fat guys were running and responding with a rifle, no shotguns. Lets get ahead of the game here and in the training.

  6. #6
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    Of the dozens of legitimate issues at that department this is the one you choose to complain about? You must be rookies

  7. #7
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    Awww Did the big bad old shotgun hurt your sensitive little shoulder. Oh poor baby

  8. #8
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    Another useless tool that will never be used unless you are hog hunting. But someone went to a class and got trained in it and they spent thousands to buy them, so now we are stuck with them. The sad thing is, every requalification, they have to teach you how to un jam it and load and use it correctly to put the rounds in it.. This is all supposed to be done in a combat situation with live fire coming at you and they have to reteach you every range day how to clear it and use it.., duh, get a clue.. In the old days I heard they would even dip their cigarette buds in it or put their chewed up gum down the barrel, because it was never used. Clue, get with the times of an Active Shooter USF PD.

  9. #9
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    One thing that has not been touched on here so far is accuracy. lethality and over-penetration. If any of you miss with the rifle that you so eagerly desire, you have a very high velocity bullet that will literally travel until it hits something or someone that stops it. In a confined area such as an enclosed room in a building, there is always a risk of over-penetration, even if you hit what you are aiming at. The 5.56mm round is light and fast and has no problem going through walls.

    The shotgun has a more limited maximum effective range and that is why it is preferred for intermediate law enforcement and military applications such as room and building clearing. Buckshot is highly lethal and there are no single flyer pellets if the 8-pellet, OO-Buck configuration is selected at ranges up to 20 yards using the improved cylinder bore typically found in LE scatterguns. For extended ranges up to 100 yards, the slug is the preferred option and has plenty of energy to get the job done.

    Regarding the weight differences, they are negligible; the shotgun weighs about 7.75 loaded and the m4 carbine weighs about 7.5 with a 30-rd mag, much more if you add accessories.

    The bottom line is this: Regardless of era, the shotgun is the preferred weapon out to intermediate ranges. The pistol is a thing of convenience but should be thought of as insufficient for lifesaving purposes and used only to fight to get to something more substantial...like the shotgun. The rifle is fine when you cannot reach the perpetrator with the shotgun; otherwise the shotgun is the absolute best choice to survive a gunfight and to mitigate collateral damage.

    Disclosure: I do not work for USFPD but the thread title caught my eye, so I figured I would comment. I work for TPD and have seen recent combat with the USMC Infantry. I would carry a shotgun on patrol 24/7 if it were permitted and only transition to the pistol if the shotgun were to hiccup.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    The Shotgun training is a fake useless training of a weapon that no one would most likely use today in his/ her career that has been taught since the first police original organized police academy in 1968, but is forced training and not up to date with the times. Almost as bad as the ASP training you have to go through year after year, but no officer has ever used an ASP, even since the Rodney King beating by police with batons since 1991. Better tools have been invented and used since then ,i.e.., Chemical spray and Tasers.
    Getting a bit off topic but too many Officers are Taser dependent and when it doesn't work they freeze, they do not know what to do and it becomes dangerous! No matter the tools you have, you must be able and willing to go hands on at some point. Some officers still use their ASP, usually those who know how to use it. Does it always work? Nope, again it's a tool.
    Chemical sprays? My feeling is Officers use them less and less.
    Shotgun vs AR15 or the likes? I'll pick the AR in most situations but I would surely not feel naked with a reliable 12 gauge in many situation.

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