CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD - Page 3
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  1. #21
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    Quote Originally Posted by Guest
    Lets face it if this was a white kid nobody would care less. And it would not matter if the shooter was white or black. The pimps and whore mongers like Jerkson and evil Al are going to play this for everything it's worth. Rememeber these two clowns need a good tragedy like this every once in a while to keep themselves relevent to the ignorant blacks who still idiolize them. To say that they don't wait for a phone call like this would be an understatement. I can just see how giddy they must get behind closed doors that they can go out and play the race card, but in public they put on that sad grimace face that they know how to wear oh so well. Stay safe my brothers and sisters of Sanford PD because in a situation like this you are going to get just as much blame as the guy who pulled the trigger.
    Let's face it. If it were a white kid killed by a black man, this would be easy, the black man would have been arrested. You may not like the circus that Al or Jesse brings but there's no doubt in my mind, were it not for social media, and raising this issue to a national level, the family would still not have received any information from the Sanford PD. This is where the problem lies. A more professional department would have handled this differently. Its sad that the death of a 17-yr old boy has to be reduced to this nonsense. Nothing is important at this time other than getting to the truth. All this ancillary nonsense is just noise. Sanford PD screwed this up from the beginning from investigative, community relations, and providing information to the family...it's sad.

  2. #22
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    All this "it's not a race issue" one minute while seeing on the news "if it were a white kid killed by a black man................" only creates more hate. Seeing idiots like Jessie Jackson and Al sharpton spewing anti-white bantor on the tv only pushes the educated people further away from the issue. I remember a time when Mr. Jackson referred to Jewish people as "hymies". Al Sharpton disappeared for years after Tawana Brawly confessed that she lied about her story. Neither of these two clowns will EVER bring us together. They not only create/continue a hatred of a particular race (white), but they also INTENTIONALLY keep the racial tension going. Without it, they'd be nothing.

    Oh, and before I forget, these two clowns owe money to a lot of people for hotels, food, cab service, etc., etc., which they feel they are owed. Every time they do an event like this, it costs them next to nothing out of their pocket, but will cost the family, you, and I.

  3. #23
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    Let's make it real simple. Zimmerman is of mixed race...Latino and White. Let's just agree that the white half of Zimmerman is the half that killed this kid. That should make all of the Sharptonites real happy and relieved.

    :snicker:

  4. #24
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    Quote Originally Posted by Rev Al
    Let's make it real simple. Zimmerman is of mixed race...Latino and White. Let's just agree that the white half of Zimmerman is the half that killed this kid. That should make all of the Sharptonites real happy and relieved.

    :snicker:
    I see what you're getting at, but Zimmerman isn't mixed, because Latino isn't a race. I'm not convinced it's a race issue on Zimmerman's part. I do know he was armed when he decided to go after Trayvon, making this whole mess his fault. I also know that someone, either in the PD or the SAO is the one (or ones) whose fault it is that Zimmerman wasn't charged...that might be a racial issue, but FDLE and the FBI will have to do some serious digging to complete that part of the case.

  5. #25
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    From what I heard on the news last night, the lead investigator in this case wanted to charge George Zimmerman on the night of this killing. He didn't buy Zimmerman's story, and was going to charge him with Manslaughter, but the Chief and Prosecutor overuled him. I was a homicide investigator for my own agency for many years, and we always involve the SAO whenever we work a homicide of any kind. I have to assume other agencies do the same thing (I'm also in central Florida). and I found it odd that the SAO on this case didn't come forward right away and back up the police. It wasn't until the last few days that we found out why. He made the decision to release Zimmerman, then let the police take the fall for the decision. It sounds like he and the Chief were more worried about civil liability than they were worried about doing the right thing. The lead detective is probably someone who actually knows how to do his job. I feel sorry for him right now, because he's being forced to accept a lot of criticism he doesn't deserve. Politics doesn't belong anywhere near homicide investigations, but that's where it ends up, and it usually mucks things up. When experienced people are allowed to do their jobs, they do it well. Crap like this happens when the desk jockey's get involved.

    Zimmerman should have been charged the night this happened. The evidence most certainly supports a lawful arrest. Zimmerman was on his way to the store on a personal errand when he saw Trayvon Martin walking home. He made the decision that walking home, wearing a hoodie, was somehow suspicious. He called 911 to report it. His activity should have stopped there, or at least when he lost sight of Martin. If he decided to follow Martin as a Captain of his Neighborhood Watch, he should have left his weapon in his vehicle. Carrying a weapon as a Neighborhood Watch member is strictly against their rules. In essence, he was stalking Martin at that point. Martin had committed no crime that Zimmerman was aware of. The 911 operator was correct to tell Zimmerman to back off and let the police handle the situation. If he had done that, martin would have been able to make it home, and none of this would be an issue. If Martin really did confront Zimmerman, he was well within HIS rights under the Stand Your Ground law to defend himself against a perceived threat. Following Martin, then getting his butt kicked by him, doesn't fall under the Stand Your Ground law for Zimmerman. I have investigated shootings that occurred under that law, and Zimmerman's claim isn't covered by that law. You aren't standing your ground, or defending yourself when YOU are the one that initiates the incident.

    Other things to consider too are the physical size difference between Martin and Zimmerman. Martin may have been several inches taller than Zimmerman, But Zimmerman had a significant amount of weight and muscle on Martin. To think we would believe Martin tried to muscle his gun away from him is just unrealistic. It was dark, and raining. I suspect that martin didn't even know Zimmerman was armed until he was shot. According to initial police reports, Zimmerman claimed that Martin walked up to him and said "Do you have a problem?". to which Zimmerman replied, "No, I don't have a problem". He claimed Martin then said "Well you do now", and punched Zimmerman in the face. Now we're being told by Zimmerman's father and friends that Martin said he was going to kill Zimmerman. It sounds like Zimmerman is changing his story to fit that self defense claim. Unfortunately, Martin can't tell us what was really said.

    The police surveillance video shows Zimmerman being brought into the police station. It's possible that EMS cleaned up his bloody nose, and the back of his head, so we don't see much evidence of the injuries he claims he received in his life-ro-death struggle. I accept that as the reason we don't see the injuries. However, I don't accept that he was nearly as injuried as he claims he was. I would hope the Sanford Crime Scene unit photographed his injuries before he was cleaned up, so they can back up the Chief's decision to let him go. I would also hope the FBI is conducting a profile on Mr. Zimmerman right now, to determine his personality type. Zimmerman called the 911 call center 46 times in the last year. That by itself should alert them to the fact that he has issues. It's not a case of Standing Your Ground (which is a perfectly good law when used properly, by the way), or self defense, when Zimmerman was the aggressor in the incident. He targeted Martin, stalked him for no legal reason, then shot him...and unarmed kid...when that kid, whom he outweighed by at least 50 pounds, got the best of him in a physical confrontation that never would have happened if Zimmerman hadn't pursued him.

    I too believe Zimmerman is sorry for all he's done, but he still did it. He took a young boy's life for no better reason than he saw him walking in his neighborhood, and he didn't know who he was. Whether that was his intent or not, he did it, and he needs to be held accountable for it. My sympathies go out to a grieving family that deserves answers, and my wishes for safe watch go to the Sanford Police.

  6. #26
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    It's both interesting and amusing to watch you guys play Monday Morning Quarterback on this case. I think Trayvon Martin should have made it home alive that night. So far, I honestly don't get the impression that he was a threat to the neighborhood.

    Cops can't be everywhere, but prior to this case, it was more common to see a double rainbow overhead than to see a Sanford PD car in the neighborhood. They just don't come around here. Perhaps that's because other areas have more crime - I don't know. All I know is that now you can't swing a dead cat without it landing on a Sanford PD or Seminole County car. Today, there's an empty SPD car sitting right across the street from the neighborhood gate (empty).

    This isn't a bad neighborhood at all. We don't have thugs, drug dealers, or much crime beyond someone driving a bit too fast down the neighborhood road. However, folks say those condos had a few break-ins recently. Makes me wonder if it's truly folks coming from the outside to their neighborhood, or if a few folks inside did it. I don't know.

    Zimmerman was taken into custody and SPD recommended Manslaughter charge for the shooting that night. From what I know so far, that sounds like SPD did it's job. Had there been a bit more communication, perhaps this wouldn't be the national issue it is today.

  7. #27
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    If you rarely see patrol units in your neighborhood, then consider that a good thing. It means you don't have a lot of crime. Law enforcement generally cover large areas, but they focus attention on problem areas. Money and man/woman power dictate where this focus needs to be. From what I understand, the community where this incident occurred is gated. If that is true, then you won't see patrol units in there unless they have a specific reason to be there. It would be interesting to know what types of burglaries the community experienced, how many, and in what time frame they occurred. If they were vehicle burglaries, I would bet the vehicles were left unlocked. In a short time frame, it was probably done by 1 or 2 individuals who were walking through the neighborhood, trying doors. These types of crimes are usually isolated. Gated communities usually enjoy a pretty crime free environment. When they experience crime, it's often juveniles who live there.

  8. #28
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    Quote Originally Posted by Rush Bimbaugh
    It's both interesting and amusing to watch you guys play Monday Morning Quarterback on this case. I think Trayvon Martin should have made it home alive that night. So far, I honestly don't get the impression that he was a threat to the neighborhood.

    Cops can't be everywhere, but prior to this case, it was more common to see a double rainbow overhead than to see a Sanford PD car in the neighborhood. They just don't come around here. Perhaps that's because other areas have more crime - I don't know. All I know is that now you can't swing a dead cat without it landing on a Sanford PD or Seminole County car. Today, there's an empty SPD car sitting right across the street from the neighborhood gate (empty).

    This isn't a bad neighborhood at all. We don't have thugs, drug dealers, or much crime beyond someone driving a bit too fast down the neighborhood road. However, folks say those condos had a few break-ins recently. Makes me wonder if it's truly folks coming from the outside to their neighborhood, or if a few folks inside did it. I don't know.

    Zimmerman was taken into custody and SPD recommended Manslaughter charge for the shooting that night. From what I know so far, that sounds like SPD did it's job. Had there been a bit more communication, perhaps this wouldn't be the national issue it is today.
    I don't so much think it's Monday morning quarterbacking as much as it is pointing out definitive issues.

    If I have PC to make an arrest, I'm going to make it. If I go to the SAO and they tell me not to because they say they can't get a conviction, I will have them produce that in writing. When they refuse, I will make the arrest anyways, and take the case to the Office of Statewide Prosecution and tell them why.

  9. #29
    Guest

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    It was wonderful to see the Board of City Commisoners backing up the PD and the chief! It is about time someone does not back down under peer presure. Stay safe out there and watch your six!!

  10. #30
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
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    146

    Re: CHIEF LEE, IT DOESNT LOOK GOOD

    [quote=Miami area LEO]
    Quote Originally Posted by Guest
    Quote Originally Posted by "Miami area LEO":cfltyqw5
    What I can definitively say is that in Dade County, GZ would have been locked up immediately after the 911 recording was listened to.
    Thank God that the rest of Florida does not operate like the Gestapo in Miami.

    The Sanford Police Department said officers were prohibited from arresting Zimmerman the night of the shooting because physical evidence and testimony supported his claim that he acted in self-defense in accordance with Florida law. The police department gave the explanation to City Manager Norton Bonaparte, who included it in a letter to the community about the case, posted on the city's website.

    Zimmerman said he was driving in his gated community when he saw Martin walking and called 911 to report a suspicious person.

    Sonner says his client was injured that night and went to the hospital with a broken nose and a serious cut on the back of his head.
    The "Gestapo" in Miami (Dade County as a whole) know what we are doing. We conduct major investigations daily, and by the dozens. We deal with dirt bags the likes that you have never heard of. We are not discriminatory towards non-WASPS, and we don't protect the guilty.

    So GZ was injured...so what? Why did he go after someone he had no legal grounds to go after. The injury occurred as the result of Trayvon defending himself from an attacker. Your evidence is clear: A civilian watchman took it upon himself to take a series of actions that escalated to a tragic end...PERIOD. George Zimmerman is NOT authorized to perform police functions.

    Crime watch does not make you a police officer. Crime watch does not allow you to patrol with a gun, regardless of CWP. Zimmerman acted illegally. His vigilantism was a violation of FSS, and his killing of Trayvon Martin is manslaughter at best.

    I said it before, and I will say it again. If you are not a police officer, have fun stopping me. I will fight you with all that I have, up to and including lethal force. I have that right, and so did Trayvon. The difference is that George Zimmerman took that most basic right from Trayvon, ultimately killing him.

    Based upon my personal knowledge of Trayvon's home town, the 911 recordings I've heard, and my experience as a detective for the last 6 years, I have pieced the following together:

    -GZ saw Trayvon, followed him, and called 911
    -Trayvon knew it and wanted to know why he was being followed
    -GZ likely pulled the gun at that moment
    -Trayvon is no fool and saw it; he ran away immediately
    -GZ took it upon himself to go after Trayvon
    -Fight ensued, gun fired, Trayvon dead

    Since Zimmerman has no right to chase, detain, stop, or arrest anyone, he initiated unlawful actions that directly led to the death of Trayvon Martin. Further, Trayvon was fully within his rights to defend himself against Zimmerman, who became the attacker. So, if Zimmerman went to the hospital, tough shit for him.

    George Zimmerman didn't defend himself. He attacked his victim and killed him.[/quote:cfltyqw5]


    Good God! Now I know why Miami PD has such a horrible reputation! He likely did this, he likely did that. Your opinion means nothing. Did you witness this incident Miami area leo? NOPE. Did anyone witness what actually happened? Again, NOPE! So, speculate all you want to. And keep making yourself look like a fool! As more and more of what happened comes out, you keep looking like a bigger and bigger FOOL!

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