staffing

If Clearwater is so short handed, why do I hear so many horror stories about your FTO's. I obviously dont know much about your program, but I have been told by several officers that I work with, that Clearwater seems to enjoy washing out officers, and then they leave and go on to be great officers at other agencies. Is it only a few of your guys killing the new people or is this information not true? I cant say the city I work for is perfect, but our FTO's have common sense, you should know who the good guys are and know who are just total idiots.

FTO's "wash out" the recruits because they could not make the program. They could not make the program for several reason. Example: Mulit-task, report writing, attitudes, ect.

If these Recruits make it else where then great for them. We do not except the PAR. Some people need more thank 18 weeks (including extentions)of training. We do not go past this limit. Some recruits need a slower paced dept.

As for the staff shortage it is not the FTO's fault. Why would we just take people to put on the street. That does not make sense and it is not safe. Neither is the staff shortage.

Do you want a properly trained officer or a body? Ill take the officer and you keep your body with the other dept.

For being a 35 Square Mile City......Clearwater is simply above the rest as far as proficiency. Chief Klein grooms his Captains for Chief positions which is what they go on to be.
Thats just a simple fact.
The faint hearted need not apply.

There is no doubt there are some good FTo's at Clearwater. But there are also some FTO's who have there priorities out of order. I have heard their "RULES" regarding report writing and saving the reports till the end of the shift so they get their overtime. That's hardly the proper way to train a recruit with no experience. He/SHe barely knows what they are doing, so we pile reports on them when they are already tired/stressed from the work day. Then we grade the reports as if we are Literature Professors. The new officer's who make it through the program, now have to be re-trained on time management. If you disagree, simply look at the end of days/day relief, evening, and mids shifts... you very rarely see senior officers typing their paper.....But you routinely see junior guys catching up. Again, no hit on the FTO Program as a whole, because we have some real god ones, but let's not paint the picture that we are perfect and have not let some decent recruits slip past us.

Yea, lets just lower the standards and let everyone thru. Lets not teach recruits about being so busy, that there will be times when their on their own when the come to work and will already be down a few reports because of being so short handed on the road, they were running for call to call.

20- somethings today have been spoon fed by their "Helicopter Parents" who are parents who never want their child to fail, fall, loose, or be told they're not good enough. It's always someone elses fault, not the childs nor the parents rearing of that child. Lets just push thru a report FULL of misspelled words for some two-bit defense lawyer to tear the officer apart on the witness stand one day because he doesn't know how to construct complete sentences, nor spell basic words, and produces a product not worthy of a 4th grade language class.

Life and police work are not for those who think they want to dress up in a costume on Halloween and show off their badges to pretty girls. Set high standards and make people come up to those standards. Not have an organization who's mission statement is "Come to CPD, we'll hire you and pay you, and you won't have to work very hard for your money - just like when you lived at home with your Mommy"

[JAFO]

No one ever said police work was easy.

Too many arrive at the front door now-a-days with a silver spoon and some degree thinking all they have to do is show up. Problem is, many can’t think for themselves or have the strength to fight their way out of a paper bag. There’s a big difference between book sense and common sense and we see it everyday.

No one is limited to one single FTO. I believe they switch around so that they are better trained and more then one person evaluates them. If there is a problem, they need to tell someone in charge so the problem can be resolved.

The FTO program puts a lot of pressure on them and you can see how they measure up and they are informed that fact from the beginning. They are given guidelines and resource material and they either make it or break it on their own resources. When they tell you to study some particular subject because there’s a quiz or a test coming up they mean it. Coming to work unprepared is not acceptable. It’s part of learning and developing good work habits early on for the rest of your career. If there’s an identifiable and correctable problem that’s one thing, but if someone just can’t cut the mustard and is full of excuses that’s another.

Too many get caught up in the moment and trip over themselves because they can’t think straight. Yea, they may do well at a written test but when tested on the street where they have to improvise, adapt or overcome is another matter.

Our department is not so large that someone gets lost in the shuffle where there’s always enough officers around to hold your hand and do your work for you. And that's why we like to see our officers properly trained or at least have the basic fundementals to succeed.

I agree that standards are important and from hearing from you guys, I guess the stories that I hear are not correct. The impression that I got was that your FTO's were nitpicking little things and making peoples lives miserable even if they were trying and were good officers and that to the FTO's these peolpe practically had to be flawless or perfect to pass, which none of us are perfect. Standards should be set high, but reasonable at the same time.

22 out of 25 of your applicants failed that were given the chance of employment if they passed with their FTO in 2005. I'm not really sure where problem is but there has to be one somewhere. Either someone doesn't know how to pick people that can make it or your training program is a little bit to anal. Since I'm not an LEO though clue me in if it's normal for 90% to fail with their FTO, but make it through the rest of the process.

I am an officer with less then one year of time at CPD and can say that my experience with the program was not like the horror stories you are hearing. Sure there were hard times and tough standards to meet, but the preparation for the road was second to none. I had three FTO's and none of them were alike. They all had strengths and weaknesses but the thing that they all shared was the desire to have a coworker they could trust with their life. My FTO's didn't nitpick small things. They did however stress officer safety, time management, and following procedure. I don't mean to suggest that the program is perfect, but I do feel prepared to do my job on a daily basis.

22 out of 25 of your applicants failed that were given the chance of employment if they passed with their FTO in 2005. I'm not really sure where problem is but there has to be one somewhere. Either someone doesn't know how to pick people that can make it or your training program is a little bit to arse. Since I'm not an LEO though clue me in if it's normal for 90% to fail with their FTO, but make it through the rest of the process.

Your stats are wrong and I do not know where you received them.

You asked what is one point that is wrong .... Lets start with the ACADEMY.
The academy is a college course now and anyone can sign up. I mean anyone. The academy has dropped their standards to assist other academies around the state. This was the First mistake. CMS does not help either.

There are people in the academy that seek a profession as a police officer that have no business being here. The FTO program sorts them out and trains them to see if they are qualified officers. Just because you went through the academy and watched a few Cop shows does not mean you can do this job.

I have recently graduated from the Police Academy in another state. Although it was held at a University, in no-way, shape or form was it anything like a college class. Anyone with a few grand in their pocket was able to enroll, and it didn't matter if you had a felony in your background, they wanted your money and you were willing to give it. Not like it used to be when a Department put you through extensive background checks and interviews and once they thought you were worth the investment, would pay your way thru Cop School.

There were 'kids' in that class that had no business being there. There were 'adults' in that class that were not much better. While most bragged about their 4 year degree in Criminal Justice, they also added it had nothing to do with police work. (Or what they knew it to be) The Academy teaches a VERY, VERY basic curriculm. How you learn to be a cop is something within you, and what you learn on the road.

I'm aware of several Criminal Justice college grads that went thru the Academy and are doing other things. I'd say 50% of my Academy class are not officers. Please don't think upon exiting the Academy you know about police work, report writing, or investigating crimes. Academy think they know it call because they've taken Criminal Justice for 4 years, went thru the Academy, and watched a few episodes of COPS. None of that teaches you how to talk to people, time management, nor problem solving skills.

22 out of 25 of your applicants failed that were given the chance of employment if they passed with their FTO in 2005. I'm not really sure where problem is but there has to be one somewhere. Either someone doesn't know how to pick people that can make it or your training program is a little bit to arse. Since I'm not an LEO though clue me in if it's normal for 90% to fail with their FTO, but make it through the rest of the process.

Your stats are wrong and I do not know where you received them.

You asked what is one point that is wrong .... Lets start with the ACADEMY.
The academy is a college course now and anyone can sign up. I mean anyone. The academy has dropped their standards to assist other academies around the state. This was the First mistake. CMS does not help either.

There are people in the academy that seek a profession as a police officer that have no business being here. The FTO program sorts them out and trains them to see if they are qualified officers. Just because you went through the academy and watched a few Cop shows does not mean you can do this job.


Well I wrote a lengthy response but either it was deleted or didnt come through. Anyways those stats are taken off the CPD website and again I'm not an LEO so I don't really know much but... Why would I just make up some random number unless I thought the source was credible? I find it odd that almost 90% of people hired fail the FTO part. That's why I believe there's a possiblity that someone can't pick applicants well or the FTO's are to hard. Pure speculation and you may be right that there are people going though the academy who shouldn't.


Anyways this is what it says on the CPD website.

"CPD Recruitment - The challenges in finding the best candidates who can successfully complete all aspects of training as a law enforcement officer can be challenging. In 2005, the department hired 25 new police officer candidates and lost 22 of them during the training process. This calculates to over an 88% loss. Join Chief Klein and his guest Sergeant Terry Teunis as they take a close look at the national problem posed to law enforcement in the recruitment and retention of police officers."

Am I not interpreting this right?

Hmmm did not see that.........but as stated before here is two problems.


The academy is a college course now and anyone can sign up. I mean anyone. The academy has dropped their standards to assist other academies around the state. This was the First mistake. CMS does not help either.

There are people in the academy that seek a profession as a police officer that have no business being here. The FTO program sorts them out and trains them to see if they are qualified officers. Just because you went through the academy and watched a few Cop shows does not mean you can do this job.

First of all, the website is wrong. In 2005, 21 out of 25 hired did not get to become police officers on their own at CPD. Prior to the FTO program, new recruits go through a six week orientation (like a mini-police academy) to prepare themselves for the FTO program/being a street cop. Many of those recruits were lost there. Examples, being consistently late for work, could not qualify with their firearm, etc. I am sure anyone would agree those officers should have been fired. Several others of those 21 officers decided to resign on their own for family/personal reasons, moved out of state, or took employment elsewhere. I believe it was only approximately 25% of the officers that actually failed the FTO program in 2005.

In the last two recruit classes CPD had in 2006, which consisted of 25 plus recruits, most of them did make it. Why? Not because of the FTO changing from 2005, but simply a better hiring selection.

Some officers do not make the FTO program and make it somewhere else. Yes, some of them do become good officers and good for them. They received 20 plus weeks of good training and get to start from the beginning again. I guess they just needed that extra time. I wish those officers good luck and be safe out there.

Oh, and to address the one comment about the OT rule. I would rather expose a recruit to as much as possible on the streets, then having them type their reports in the middle of the shift while all the calls/action are occurring. Fact: Recruits only average 2 reports a day. Wow! We are really piling up the reports for them.

My message for people interested in CPD would be to step up to the plate and worry about you, not statistics. You decide you faith, not past recruits.

CALLS/ACTION?...Where the heck is CPD? Just outside Las Angeles? Give me a break....You don't even want names thrown out there who routinely take 2 calls a day,let alone reports. Like it was said...there are some real good ones out there, but don't blanket the program as such a great success. There is and never will be enough calls for service to give a recruit enough experience to call him a good officer after the FTO program. Experience comes with time. You should be training the recruits to do the job and experience will happen. It should have no bearing on your paycheck and the overtime.

I see the stats just worried me a bit when seeing almost 90% failed. I'm interested in becoming an LEO for Clearwater or a nearby agency so I was browsing the website when I came upon the stats. Basically I was thinking s*** that doesn't seem very promising.

Though it didn't mention exaclty why 22 out of 25 didn't make it, I'm glad it wasn't just for not being able to hack it. I'm probably going to enter the police academy at St. Pete college in the summer but have no clue if I'm really cut out for the work. I'm going to try and get into one of the citizen academies and do some ride alongs as well. All I know is I have an interest in the work but I'm not dumb enough to believe I can do it from just watching forensic files/cops all day.

You wrote: "There is and never will be enough calls for service to give a recruit enough experience to call him a good officer after the FTO program."

Who ever said the above statement? You are obviously reading into something that is not there. Of course it takes time and experience to become a good officer. And nobody is out to make the FTO program better then it is, but if you read the other posts, some people are misinformed of the facts. Facts are facts, do your own research. There are good/bad in everything (departments, jobs, positions, people, etc). You sound like an officer here at CPD to know so much about the FTO’s and what they do and don’t do. If that is the case, step up to the plate and save the program from its demise.

To Guest:

I am already an FTO thanks. My statement was simply that FTO's should not train recruits based on their need for O.T., and using the excuse that they are taking more calls for service instead of doing paper is not productive for training. When the recruit gets released, he is still in FTO mode and routinely gets backed up on paper. ALSO FACTS. Train as if your an officer and the experience will come. P.S. I am certain I have more time on here than you and have done more than you so do not challenge anyone to step up>

Simmer down now.

Getting through FTO at CPD is all about getting the right FTOs. There are some who forget that they were a rookie at one time and made mistakes. There are a lot of good Officers and Deputies working for other agencies, who were washed out of CPD's FTO. I am one of them.

FTO felt like initiation more than it did training. I never felt like part of the brotherhood. I'll admit that I am probably a little bitter still, but the FTO program at CPD does have some serious issues that people there seem to ignore. CPDs philosophy is take the best applicants and throw them all at the wall, then see what sticks. Sometimes what sticks isn't the best Officer and sometimes what falls off is pretty good.

CPD is a damn good agency and there are a lot of good guys and gals working there, but you just have to get through the weeding out process that is the FTO program to find out.

People want to work there and the quality of Officers is higher than most.