HIRING QUESTION ?????????

I recently applied and I do not have a college degree. I was interviewed and took a basic skills test and was also fingerprinted at the Miami Office. I was notified that I passed the test and was asked to go to Jacksonville for an additional interview and a physical agility test. I'M I WASTING MY TIME ? Can someone please advise me. Thank you.

Yeah, same here. I was deemed "Qualified" and put in their pool. Never heard from them again. I don't have college either but spent a lot of money going back and forth for apparently nothing, and that's with 20 years investigation experience.
I've always had nothing against college, but when it's a major qualifying factor to get a job, and you have no experience it don't mean jack to me.
I'll run circles around anyone who just got out of college on investigations, no disrespect intended to college grads.
The school of life experience is the best school you can go to.
I would really try and go somewhere else....you'll be waiting a long time waiting for something that isn't coming.

Miami is always running short and looking for good people. I would follow through, its like the lottery, if you don't play you can't win!!

Rumor has it that there are 26 vacant positions in Miami, mostly due to the Racino (Para-mutual facility gambling) staffing.

If you read between the lines on posts on this board, our current Commissioner wants a degree. The department is unable to make this a written requirement because it would cause a problem with educational incentive monies paid to officers.

I agree with the last post. Press on. We have vacant positions, lets see if we can wait two years to fill them with degrees or if we will use the experience/equivalency solution.

Most of the agents would rather have an "experienced" officer.

This agency is Hiring. Take a close look at the Forum to see how Corrupt this Agency is....
As an Employee, I would like to see FDLE come in and clean house....Starting with Balkwill and Dunklee

Anyone have input on if Bailey or Tucker will waive the required BA degree if the local SAC asks? Tons of local investigative experience.

I would say that it is possible. You would be better served to have a sheriff put in a good word for you than a SAC. They have much more pull with the Commish than a SAC. And most SACs won't put themselves out on a limb like that.

There was a class many years back that had a female not only without a college degree but without a high school diploma as well. She did have a GED. Her outstanding "qualification" was that she was Leander Shaw's daughter. She has since been let go. Go figure.

The answer is yes- talk to the SAC or Tucker himself....there is no BA/BS requirement- but it is preferred. There are still a lot of agents being hired based on experience and not BA/BS.

Is there a pay table for the Agent position?

We are at the mercy of the legislature. We do not have a pay table as such, there is a "broad band range" tallyhassee speak for a salary range. There is at present no organized stable mechanism to get from base salary to the ever elusive TOP SALARY.

Agency has a Retention and Recuitment pay plan that offers salary increases amounting to $12,000 over the 16 years the plan covers. It has been funded two out of three years but has added to some compression issues.

A compression raise is on the table this year in addition to a generous proposed cost of living raise.

I expect better things from our new Governor. His likes cops and received a ton of support from the PBA.

For the other posts, those without degrees, KEEP AFTER IT. THEY CAN'T FILL VACANCIES WITH THE CURRENT SALARY STRUCTURE.

[dograck]

Heard Tallahassee approved one for Rojas last week. Retired Miami cop and a good guy. FDLE made out with this one.

Last name Lopez by any chance?

We are at the mercy of the legislature. We do not have a pay table as such, there is a "broad band range" tallyhassee speak for a salary range. There is at present no organized stable mechanism to get from base salary to the ever elusive TOP SALARY.


A compression raise is on the table this year in addition to a generous proposed cost of living raise.

I expect better things from our new Governor. His likes cops and received a ton of support from the PBA.

:lol: Sure he gave us better things :lol:

Any info on when the next PAT and interviews are, I could'nt attend the last one, or if they're going to be in Miami or Jacksonville. Thanks in advance.

to one of the earlier posters, I agree about the college degree vs. the experience but remember, they are looking for either, so if you qualify in the experience realm you should not have a problem being hired. The rate of attrition may contribute to the 2 minimum quals being changed, as opposed to the old way of experience plus education. It appears the latter way was not bringing in the bodies in the volume necessary to fill the number of positions.

I don't have crim. investigative experience but I do have a college degree and I would not argue not getting hired if someone experienced in criminal investigtations was hired over me. I do consider myself intelligent and I have over 15 years of investigative experience on the civil level and would hope that would be considered.

Why does it seem that someone with a college degree is looked down upon and presumed to have no "real life" experience?

There are many people out there with college degrees who did not come into this world with a gold spoon in their mouth. They are not the so called "spoiled brat" that a lof of people tend to think all college students are. Honestly, I dont believe that being a patrol officer is the ONLY way to become an investigator. There are so many small town patrol officers and big city officers that DO NOT work details that automatically make them a detective. Since I did grow up, went to school and have friends and family members who are criminals I can bet I am 10 times more likely to be able to identify criminal behavior better than a officer who believes you need to be in a patrol vehicle to know what criminal behavior is.

It should come down to the individual and not just ONLY a matter of college degree or police patrol experience.

That is the attitude that hurts you. You never worked patrol so you do not know what you would have learned. Put your time in and pay your dues like most of the other Agents did and than apply. You won't regret it.

leorecruitee, i have a college degree from the flagship university of this state. I also have 3 years patrol experience. I will be the first to validate the importance patrol experience. There are things that college just cant teach you that patrol will. Hanging out with criminals and thinking this will assist you in identifying the same is exactly what the lack of life and patrol experience will do. Pound for pound, patrol severly overshadows a college degree. I say this both as a college grad, former patrol officer and current law student.

There is no way that patrolling qualifies you as having life experience. That is really what I disagree with. Like I said in my closing statement it should not only come down to if you have a degree or if you have patrol experience. I believe is should include both as a criteria and then the individual personality. Just because you are a police officer DOES NOT automatically qualify you as having life experience. That is a terrible assumption to make that a police officer qualifies someone as a person with life experience. I have experienced things in life many many police officers will never experience from being hungry, to almost getting kicked ouf of a university because of lack of funds to pay for school, to coming to the United States with nothing more than a bag of clothes and working hard getting paid $4 an hour to where I am today making close to 6 figures.

Again my primary argument is that it should come down to both experiences and the individual and not either or. Everyone I believe deserves a fair chance. Not everyone who went to college was a spoiled brat.

I respect any and everyone who believe they may have something to contribute to law enforcement degree or no degree, patrol or no patrol. You having a degree and patrol experience much respect to you whole heartedly. I just think that people automatically assuming all college students have no life experience is just flat out delusional and ignorant.

Another thing, I am considering the sheriff dep of my county or FHP.

There are a lot of Federal investigators/special agents that have never worked as a patrol officer and are excellent investigators. If it was the case that being a patrol officer would make or break you in an investigative capacity, no doubt the Fed would require their investigators/special agents to come with prior LEO experience.

I have to agree to an extent with LEO recruitee that it is the individual's merits that they bring to the table that should be considered, not whether they have ever been a police/leo.

I also agree that patrol experience brings a different facet of experience that can absolutely benefit the SA position with FDLE. For some, perhaps spending time on the road is not an option for one reason or another and also perhaps it is not necessary for some people given their own lifes experience that they might bring to the table. An individual with a college degree doesn't mean that person is going to make it in the working world either, again, it is the individual and their experiences that they are bringing to the table that will help or defeat the person in the position. Conversely, a person with prior leo experience doesn't guarantee that they will make it as an investigator either.

My question is, are there any FDLE Special Agents that do not have prior LEO experience that are good investigators? If any of you FDLE SA's that have prior LEO experience can answer yes, then I think the debate is answered.

My .02 worth.

I am a FDLE special agent in the Miami region. I have years of experience on a response agency in "street work." I also have a college degree. In the DLE there are many agents that were internal hires, that is they were not LEOs befor they came here. Most are very good at long-term, complex investigations. I would submit that they lack a skill set, however. And that lack becomes a potential issue when we are tasked to do hurricane response, jail/prison breaks and special initiatives like targeting street crime. On the street one learns to be assertive and control situations, one learns to recognize deceptive behavior and combat it, one sees a growing risk of attack or flight. One learns that he/she will (hopefully) survive an attack and respond using good and legal tactics. These same mutts that we target grew up on the same streets and will quickly test if the LEO they are dealing with to see if he/she has street smarts. And when it all goes sideways, a LEO no street experience is at best a question until the crap hits and he/she learns that he/she can cope, or a liability if he/she becomes overwhelmed. That is the difference. You can learn street smarts, but it comes with practice and hard knocks.

Guest,

You made a valid point with regard to street smarts/experience on the street. While no one wants to find out in the 11th hour if they can hack a situation as you indicated in your post "These same mutts that we target grew up on the same streets and will quickly test if the LEO they are dealing with to see if he/she has street smarts. And when it all goes sideways, a LEO no street experience is at best a question until the crap hits and he/she learns that he/she can cope, or a liability if he/she becomes overwhelmed. That is the difference. You can learn street smarts, but it comes with practice and hard knocks."

With that being said above, and I would never wish anyone to get hurt, but I also feel that people (prospective applicants for an FDLE SA position) should be given the opportunity to prove themselves, leo experience or not. I would certainly hope that the academy would provide significant training and that those agents that have "street" experience would mentor the agents with no prior leo experience as the patrol officers do during FTO. I don't know, perhaps mentoring is not possible?

While there are a number of different areas that FDLE investigates, what percentage of those areas would you consider warrant "street smarts" as a whole or on a regular basis? I ask this not in a confrontational manner but in one in which to learn. As I was informed, a large portion of an SA's time is "desk bound" (so I am told and I have no idea whether that is true or not). I would imagine it depends on what type of cases they are assigned.

I guess what I am trying to say is that I feel people need to be more tolerant to those with or without prior leo experience applying for positions with FDLE as an SA. Give them a chance to prove themselves. Again I agree with you that having street smarts is inherently important to the job but at the same time perhaps people with good common sense can learn those things through agents that are willing to take the time to teach/mentor rather than complain about what people are lacking.

There are a lot of Federal investigators/special agents that have never worked as a patrol officer and are excellent investigators. If it was the case that being a patrol officer would make or break you in an investigative capacity, no doubt the Fed would require their investigators/special agents to come with prior LEO experience.

I have to agree to an extent with LEO recruitee that it is the individual's merits that they bring to the table that should be considered, not whether they have ever been a police/leo.

I also agree that patrol experience brings a different facet of experience that can absolutely benefit the SA position with FDLE. For some, perhaps spending time on the road is not an option for one reason or another and also perhaps it is not necessary for some people given their own lifes experience that they might bring to the table. An individual with a college degree doesn't mean that person is going to make it in the working world either, again, it is the individual and their experiences that they are bringing to the table that will help or defeat the person in the position. Conversely, a person with prior leo experience doesn't guarantee that they will make it as an investigator either.

My question is, are there any FDLE Special Agents that do not have prior LEO experience that are good investigators? If any of you FDLE SA's that have prior LEO experience can answer yes, then I think the debate is answered.

My .02 worth.

Excellent point. And very true.

I am a Special Agent and spend little time behind a desk. I work daily with the local agencies in my county working various drug and violent crime cases and in an undercover capacity. Everyday there is a real possibility of being involved in a confrontation. I do not know what the guest is looking for who does not have experience that wants to be hired as an SA. There are enough Agents here who do not leave their desks, we do not need more! No offense but go be an accountant if thats what you are looking for. We do not work patrol or respond to calls for service but we are still LEO's and don't expect the 8 week SA Academy to prepare you for the real world.

Here in the Miami Region we have specialized squads and work large, long-term cases. If you are on a fraud squad, you'll do fraud. If you do dope, or public integrity, that's what you'll do. It's not uncommon for a case to last for years. Heck, we even have squads assigned to the racinos, (parimutuels that have racing and are now allowed slots. There are 3 in Broward, maybe more if the Gov. gets a pact with the tribes, and a possibility of 3 more in Dade next year.)

We are one of seven regions, but comprise almost a quarter of the SAs when fully staffed. I understand that it's different where the locals need more help. If we disappeared tomorrow, the Miami-Dade Police or Broward Sheriff's Office wouldn't even notice. My northern brothers and sisters tell tales of working all sorts of cases with local and county agencies. DLE assistance is typically not needed here due to the specialized squads the locals have. We don't even have a lab, we use the county labs.

So overall, it depends in what area an agent works to gauge how much street work is required.

Miami Agent,

What type of cases are new agents typically assigned to? Do their backgrounds/leo experience or degrees matter when being assigned to a squad? OR, do they start out doing background investigations?

Anymore information on what a new hire can expect? Thanks.

As to your assignment here, initially it's what squad is the most needy. You're presumed to know how to do police work and if you're in fraud, you'll catch cases. Every "rookie" is assigned to a Field Training Agent for one year, but that's more to learn the FDLE way of doing things. You would work your own case. The only squads doing extensive backgrounds are the racino squads. If there is a glut of prospective SA backgrounds before an academy class, they're farmed out all over.

If you're good at fraud, you would eventually find your way to a squad, as the agents good at violent crime find their way there and hone their craft. Be advised, here in Miami we work only major cases: multiple victim, multiple jurisdiction with some sort of identifiable criminal group or entities that need to be disrupted. It's complicated and long-term, and we frequently work with multiple agencies across the jurisdictions. Cargo theft is a good example. The Miami guys end up all over the state and there's been some gunplay.

It's been my experience that if an agent wants to go to a certain squad, the agent would talk to that supervisor and when a vacancy opens, the agent would go in. It's a formal, informal process, if you know what I mean. For an agency with a lot of rules, we tend to be familial and a lot less rigid in that respect as contrasted with a uniformed agency.

Miami Agent,
I am currently in the hiring process and am excited to have the chance to obtian employment. Thanks for the informative posts...
Question?
How far will they let you commute to the office you are assigned?
I live in northern Palm Beach and am hoping to be assigned to either Palm Beach, Broward, or Miami...
Will I be able to commute to Miami or Broward from where I live?

It's 30 or 35 miles as the crow flies, as a rule. Like anything else, the SAC can waive that rule, and sometimes does. Commonly, they don't like to burn the cars up and West Palm agents live up there. Most everybody else lives mostly in Broward as the Regional Operations Center is just off the 'pike at the Dolphin Mall.

How can I Contact the West Palm Beach Agent in charge?
Do you have an email address for the office?
I haven’t found any email addresses by surfing the web...
Do you think it would be appropriate to make contact with the Agent in charge this way by sending an introductory email and resume?

How do new hire agents with or without leo experience learn to do investigations where they have NO experience. For example, using a new agent that HAS LEO experience from road patrol, how does that agent learn to conduct fraud investigations or other investigations for which they have no experience?

They don't they need at least 3-5 years of investigative experience before they are comsidered.

4 years sworn LEO experience or 4 year degree... in either case an applicant might not have investigative experience. You are rated on the experience you bring in via a 3 tier level. LEO with investigative, LEO w/out investigative experience, 4 yr. degree/no investigative experience etc... so it is conceivable that an applicant, if hired, will not have investigative experience and if they don't, I don't know how they will learn to conduct various investigations where they don't have knowledge of that area.

The Resident Agent in Charge, (RAC), is Michael Driscoll at 1400 Centrepark Blvd. in WPB 33401 - 800/226-3019.

Thank you for the info...

What is the best way to contact the RAC? phone? mail? or in person?

I just dont want to do anything that may be considered inappropriate...

He has good phone skills. Seriously, just call him up and explain why you're calling. He's a good guy.

I know it is a touchy subject, can anyone explain how salary increases are provided?

Is there a step plan?
% raises each year?

If I were to begin employment at the $50,000 starting salary, what should I expect for the following few years?

Do you anticipate a newly negotiated plan to compete with local law enforcement?

I ask because I am processing and am very concerned because currently I make $61,000/year with my agency and will be making approx $73,000 per contract in 2009...

I don’t mind the pay cut, but I would like to know if I have the opportunity to catch up? Or how long?

Ultimately, I do have to do what is best for my family in the long run, please help!! I really want this job and I need to know what to expect?

Based on the numbers you provided, I would stay where you are.

First off, starting salary for an Agent is $46,000. The State will not pay you for experience, so you would begin at the minimum. Second, if you haven't been keeping up with the news lately...State has no money, so that means no raises, no overtime and there hasn't been a step plan in State law enforcement for quite some time and most likely it will never come back. The State finds itself in the position that local agencies were in years ago when everyone left local agencies to get better paying jobs with the State...now it's reveresed itself....stay where you are buddy....