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05-26-2006, 12:28 AM
I am a revolver PO and I still have the issued ball ammo. I hope we get hollow point soon, I am a little scared if I ever have to use my weapon. Hollow point is more effective and safer than what they have issued us.

Concerned Circuit 6 PO

05-26-2006, 01:14 AM
Ah, penny pinching. You have .38 special round nose lead cartridges for the same reason 9mm shooters have 115 grain Winchester Silvertips. It's called arsenal standardization. Because someone pointed out to the Crosby administration they didn't have control over ammo, they decided they needed to standardize. Since they haven't had any post Keith Ward defense shootings, the ammo that is good for institutions is good for P&P.

Use the public website suggestion form. They have made it harder to find, but it's still there. If you use the intra-net site, they canstill tell which regional server was utilized (can't pinpoint the office or terminal).

Anyway, get ALL your friends and co-workers to hit it.

Asst. Sec. Atchinson and company read them all.

The ammo selection for 9mm's is adequate. Don't believe any gun nuts naysayers. After all, a handgun is but a defensive sidearm. When you want to really do the job, bring a long gun to the party.

The revolver ammo selection however, is asinine.

If you do your research, the "FBI" or "Chicago" load is the +P 158 grain lead semi-wadcutter hollowpoint. The firearm rule was edited in 1993 and 1994 to allow that round to be carried. Round nose lead .38 special rounds have proven in test after test and actual street shootings to be ineffective. They over penetrate and do not expand. See the Strassbourg goat tests anddraw your own conclusion. The researchers shotone billy goat through and through and the animal continued eating for something like 38 seconds before the exasperated testing crew dispatched it with a head shot.

Continuing to carry that cartridge is asking for trouble. Get your legislators involved. Have a non-employed friend/relative carry out a public record request. Back date the current rule. Ask for all information, e-mails etc. pertaining to the change.

You'll find it was a money thing.

05-26-2006, 01:05 PM
you all have to buy your own firearms with no rembursement from your dept? i have heard of buying your own firearm but not getting payed back from your dept come on. buying your own gun driving your own car buying your own gear no overtime and very low pay with no step plan why would you work at such a place

05-26-2006, 05:56 PM
SARASOTA -- Elizabeth Stanford's probation terms required "no alcohol" when officers found an open bottle of wine on her table and champagne and beer in her refrigerator.

She was arrested for violating her probation in a DUI manslaughter case, where she drove drunk in 2002 and got into an accident that killed a passenger in her car.

But prosecutors dropped that probation violation charge Monday, saying that the condition only prohibits her from drinking alcohol -- not having it in her house.

"'No alcohol' customarily means no consumption," Assistant State Attorney Daniel Yuter said. He's never heard of a probation term prohibiting the possession of alcohol.

That just doesn't make sense to Aaron Nick, a North Port police officer whose father, Raymond Nick, was killed when Stanford turned in front of a motorcycle.

He's disappointed prosecutors didn't let Circuit Court Judge Andrew Owens, who signed Stanford's probation violation warrant, clarify what "no alcohol" means.

Probation officers thought it was a violation, prosecutors initially agreed and Stanford admitted she had a drinking problem at her sentencing, Nick said.

"Now they won't even try," he said.

Yuter said he will prosecute any probation violation, but the evidence just wasn't there in this case. There was no evidence Stanford drank any alcohol.

Other defense attorneys agreed that the "no alcohol" clause usually means no drinking but allows having alcohol to serve to guests.

Also, the benefit of the doubt goes to the defendant when probation terms are unclear, and a violation has to be willful.

Stanford said her first probation officer, Rob Atkins, gave her permission to keep alcohol in her house so she could serve guests, records state.

Atkins was suspended from work for 10 days in 2004 for allowing Stanford to leave her house arrest to go the beach and accepting gifts from her, along with other violations.

He was also a key witness in Stanford's acquittal at her last probation violation hearing, telling the judge he had verified her community service work.

At that time, leaders at Mothers Against Drunk Driving said Stanford had not worked all the hours she claimed she worked at their organization.

In the April 2002 crash, Stanford's blood-alcohol content was more than twice .08 percent, the blood-alcohol level at which a person is considered too drunk too drive.

Raymond Nick, 52, a passenger in Stanford's car, was killed. A pastor who was riding the motorcycle she hit was severely injured.

05-31-2006, 01:00 AM
I am a revolver PO and I still have the issued ball ammo. I hope we get hollow point soon, I am a little scared if I ever have to use my weapon. Hollow point is more effective and safer than what they have issued us.

Concerned Circuit 6 PO I contacted Gil Fortner of PBA in December and posted the contact under the title "rubber bullets". Gil replied that he contacted Beth A. in CO and was told DC would buy some HP ammo for our revolver shooters. I have re-contacted Gil several times and he reports repeated bureaucratic SNAFU's have prevented success. I have asked that revolver shooters be allowed to furnish their own ammo per the policy specs but have received no reply to that one. It has been 6 months and is inexcusable.

05-31-2006, 02:29 AM
[quote="TheTruth"]Use the public website suggestion form. They have made it harder to find, but it's still there. If you use the intra-net site, they canstill tell which regional server was utilized (can't pinpoint the office or terminal).


I was told several years ago, that if you did not provide you information on the suggestion form (no response or attention was given to the suggestion). But it is worth a try.

05-31-2006, 04:22 AM
We ahve been tiokd the HP ammo has been purchased, however now it is said that FDLE is requiring the officers to quakify with the ammo they are to carry. It is again a costs factor and is being looked into by the board.

05-31-2006, 10:09 AM
We are already issuing the hollow point ammo for revolver shooters at their next qualificaiton. Next year, they will then shoot their issued ammo to qualify and then be issued new ammo.

Paladin
05-31-2006, 10:25 AM
We are already issuing the hollow point ammo for revolver shooters at their next qualificaiton. Next year, they will then shoot their issued ammo to qualify and then be issued new ammo.

Please tell us what .38 HP the Department purchased. How long has your Circuit had it? Anything would be an improvement over the current ball we were issued.

Darth Duck
05-31-2006, 11:38 PM
.38 semi-jacketed HP at 110 grains,standard pressure by Remington.

06-05-2006, 02:29 AM
I heard they were in , what is up with it. Can I have my bullets?

06-09-2006, 04:01 AM
When are we getting the Ammo.

06-09-2006, 04:13 AM
When are we getting the Ammo.

I was in charge of it, now I'm a CSC in R1

06-09-2006, 11:29 PM
I've been getting mine in the back room at Rollo's.

06-12-2006, 09:45 PM
.38 semi-jacketed HP at 110 grains,standard pressure by Remington in our circuit.