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View Full Version : "Specialized" Scenarios



06-28-2007, 10:04 PM
So it was the topic in the delegates meeting at state about why we have specialized scenarios and that some of us thought we were going to stick to just patrol scenarios...

Take for example the hostage negotiation... Please tell me what patrol officer is going to roll up to the call and already have a throw phone and all the gadgets we used at state this year?

Jay Smith countered the claim about the specialized scenarios by stating that "WE" keep requesting new interesting scenarios. Yes this is true, but we've also said patrol based. He then to the affect said you can only do soo much until you have to open the door to specialized units to make it interesting. I think this is false. Because we are requesting new interesting stuff doesnít mean we want to do a scenario on computer crimes investigation (just an example).

Take the traffic stop scenario.. Last year you stopped an SUV for 2 traffic infractions, this year you stopped a Motorcycle for 1 traffic infraction and then had another with not having his license.. This is a perfect example of the request for new and interesting. Wow instead of being in a car this year you were on a bike. When we ask for new and interesting I think I can speak for everyone by saying hey maybe a DUI this year or a High Risk traffic stop I think that would be new or interesting seeing how it hasnít been done in awhile.

Just because we ask for new and interesting doesnít mean we need to get into the specialized.

The purpose of state comp scenarios should not be so difficult that you need to be an officer to get them(because remember we are NOT officers yet) it should be normal everyday things that an officer may encounter but maybe with a twist.

Think we have posts that cant even master the normal everyday scenarios that we do, how can you expect them to do a specialized scenario?

PPD Explorer
06-29-2007, 12:24 AM
Well I can tell you 1st off I think that going as far as a DUI scenario would be really difficult because of how different and hard the training would be and a High risk stop would be more appropriate ... I personaly would not mind having a DUI because i know that in my Dept. I would get very good training on DUI (Also in Active Shooter as you saw.. not bragging) ..

06-29-2007, 12:56 AM
First off I think PPD explorer is master baiting to this active shooter lol j/k but no i think you have a very valid point in saying that we dont need to get to specializied but also you have to remember since we are comming from all over the state this is hard to do. As i recentally found out some dept's a little north of us (pines) do not have c.s. Tech's so while thats "specialized" for us it isnt for them. Now my dept. has a D.U.I. task force working the road in unmarke's so if an officer gets a DUI unless they WANT to handle it one of the task force members responds and takes it.

The point im trying to make is with 38 or 40 posts from all over the state it is hard to stay completly patrol based. To be honest I didnt have a problem with what went on this year, yuh I dont enjoy crime scene in my eye's it isnt an officers jobs but some do so were never going to make everyone happy. All we can do to make it fair is in Sept. someone bring this up dont dont just say I dont want this say we can replace it w/ ....... you have to remember this is OUR competition and they adults are willing to work with us but with us means we have to do work to not just complain. I think someone should step up and take the responsibility of making a list of what they feel isnt patrol based and if agreed what could replace it, then we can vote on it as an assoc.

post435hollyhill
06-29-2007, 01:15 AM
First off I think PPD explorer is master baiting to this active shooter lol j/k but no i think you have a very valid point in saying that we dont need to get to specializied but also you have to remember since we are comming from all over the state this is hard to do. As i recentally found out some dept's a little north of us (pines) do not have c.s. Tech's so while thats "specialized" for us it isnt for them. Now my dept. has a D.U.I. task force working the road in unmarke's so if an officer gets a DUI unless they WANT to handle it one of the task force members responds and takes it.

The point im trying to make is with 38 or 40 posts from all over the state it is hard to stay completly patrol based. To be honest I didnt have a problem with what went on this year, yuh I dont enjoy crime scene in my eye's it isnt an officers jobs but some do so were never going to make everyone happy. All we can do to make it fair is in Sept. someone bring this up dont dont just say I dont want this say we can replace it w/ ....... you have to remember this is OUR competition and they adults are willing to work with us but with us means we have to do work to not just complain. I think someone should step up and take the responsibility of making a list of what they feel isnt patrol based and if agreed what could replace it, then we can vote on it as an assoc.

Okay thank you Finally.....like I've said all along, if you don't vote or speak up, you have NO RIGHT to complain!!!

FormerPCSOExplorer
06-29-2007, 08:39 PM
Man, what is the issue?

Crime Scene: Processes Crime Scenes

Detectives: Investigate

Traffic: Works Traffic

DUI: Works DUI's

Marine: Works the water.

SWAT: Handles High Risk Arrests, Search Warrants, Barricaded Suspects Etc...

The list could go on and on.

Who is the back bone of any agency?

Patrol

Patrol does whatever needs to be done.

If Crime Scene can't respond, the patrol officer should be able to process the scene.

If SWAT isn't available, what are you going to do? You are going to handle it.

I think you get my point. A patrol officer is a generalist. They must be able to do what is necessary with or without the specialized units.

I don't know when this attitude about everything being patrol based came about. Back in the day, we did:

Traffic Accident

First Aid

Traffic Stop

Crime Prevention

Crime Scene

Search and Arrest

Domestic Disturbance

Tie Breaker

Tie Breaker was anything and every thing. I remember one year it was giving a press conference.

My point is, out of all of those, Crime Prevention, Crime Scene, and Search and Arrest, the events are not typically set up as a typical Patrol call, but they are stuff that every Law Enforcement Officer should be able to do.

Just my 2 cents.

06-29-2007, 11:35 PM
Vaild point formor psco Explorer these kids now-a-days are soft, adapt and over come thats my moto. You have a gun, you have cuff's you can handle it back in the day there wasn't such things as swat teams or CRT, or SRT, and s*it still got done so why cant it now????

06-29-2007, 11:38 PM
Vaild point formor psco Explorer these kids now-a-days are soft, adapt and over come thats my moto. You have a gun, you have cuff's you can handle it back in the day there wasn't such things as SWAT teams or CRT, or SRT, and s*it still got done so why cant it now????

FormerPCSOExplorer
06-30-2007, 12:36 AM
Another Thought:

Specialty Units should have specialists from that field working in it. In other words, the experts.

If you have a Crime Scene Unit, utilize these experts to train your post. Ride with the Crime Scene Units.

I know when I was an Explorer, before you could ride patrol, you had to ride with Crime Scene for so many hours.


The bigger agencies will always have the advantage, because you have all of the specialty units whom you can learn from. That's what being an Explorer is all about learning and exploring the field of law enforcement.

06-30-2007, 03:21 AM
If ya'll want interesting scenairos, you're going to have tell them how you want them to differ.

I don't think that the SUV-> Bike was all that hard or interesting, I mean, it was a good scenairo, but it wasn't the most thought provoking of them.

Some Departments have to know how to do everything. Patrolmen do everything, they do CSI, out dept doesn't have swat, we don't have a csi team, we just do all of it.

I think that if you're complaining that the scenairos are too hard, then you need to suck it up and get your asses some better training.

06-30-2007, 06:00 AM
what i find interesting is that the posts who want some of this stuff out ARE the ones who took trophies in those events and the ones who want to keep certain scenarios are the ones who DIDNT get trophies....maybe the quote u dont know what youve got until you lose it play a little into this debate

06-30-2007, 10:34 PM
I have mixed emotions about this topic, on one hand I hate C.S. with a passion but love the the crisis intervention even thorugh thats a specialized unit. When it comes down to it I think the reason everyone Bit*hes and moans about C.S. and not the other "specilized" events is because we all love the kick a*s's now and take names later part of the events. When it comes down to pure knowladge, and understanding of criminal minds a lot of us dont want to do it or get too lazy to try. In the end my opinion is that we keep it how it is and maybe even ADD a few more forget this partol based b.s. Not saying we should put full SWAT gear on and serve warrents (although that would be fun) but its true Explorering is all about learning the FULL aspect of law enforcement and I think the competition should be the same...

post435hollyhill
07-01-2007, 12:22 AM
I have mixed emotions about this topic, on one hand I hate C.S. with a passion but love the the crisis intervention even thorugh thats a specialized unit. When it comes down to it I think the reason everyone Bit*hes and moans about C.S. and not the other "specilized" events is because we all love the kick a*s's now and take names later part of the events. When it comes down to pure knowladge, and understanding of criminal minds a lot of us dont want to do it or get too lazy to try. In the end my opinion is that we keep it how it is and maybe even ADD a few more forget this partol based b.s. Not saying we should put full SWAT gear on and serve warrents (although that would be fun) but its true Explorering is all about learning the FULL aspect of law enforcement and I think the competition should be the same...

I agree-very good view!!!!!

07-01-2007, 02:19 AM
its so easy to tell when a certain someone posts something because hes the only person in the world whose computer doesnt have a spell check

07-01-2007, 05:02 AM
the answer here is very simple. if you want to WIN, train for the scenarios at states. ive been an exp for 5 years , 4 states and this states was BY ar the most straight foward. people need to stop overthinking the scenarios and calmly evaluate their actions. thats how u win

02-10-2008, 08:09 AM
the answer here is very simple. if you want to WIN, train for the scenarios at states. ive been an exp for 5 years , 4 states and this states was BY ar the most straight foward. people need to stop overthinking the scenarios and calmly evaluate their actions. thats how u win

Thats fine, but for Crime Scene for example instead of FDLE judging it with their "specialized crime Scene" Techs have a Police Officer Tech. Shoot some of the questions they were asking last STATE were ridiculous and the only reason we got them right was because we had a Soon to be CSI on our team. If we didnt we would have never none the special database they were asking about or specific key terms.

02-10-2008, 08:10 AM
[quote="its a Hemi":1k9sqtxi]the answer here is very simple. if you want to WIN, train for the scenarios at states. ive been an exp for 5 years , 4 states and this states was BY ar the most straight foward. people need to stop overthinking the scenarios and calmly evaluate their actions. thats how u win

Thats fine, but for Crime Scene for example instead of FDLE judging it with their "specialized crime Scene" Techs have a Police Officer Tech. Shoot some of the questions they were asking last STATE were ridiculous and the only reason we got them right was because we had a Soon to be CSI on our team. If we didnt we would have never none the special database they were asking about or specific key terms.[/quote:1k9sqtxi]

Sorry I have a typo in the above comment "would have known"

I know how some people like to jump on you for a miss spelling.

03-10-2008, 10:16 AM
So it was the topic in the delegates meeting at state about why we have specialized scenarios and that some of us thought we were going to stick to just patrol scenarios...

Take for example the hostage negotiation... Please tell me what patrol officer is going to roll up to the call and already have a throw phone and all the gadgets we used at state this year?

Jay Smith countered the claim about the specialized scenarios by stating that "WE" keep requesting new interesting scenarios. Yes this is true, but we've also said patrol based. He then to the affect said you can only do soo much until you have to open the door to specialized units to make it interesting. I think this is false. Because we are requesting new interesting stuff doesnít mean we want to do a scenario on computer crimes investigation (just an example).

Take the traffic stop scenario.. Last year you stopped an SUV for 2 traffic infractions, this year you stopped a Motorcycle for 1 traffic infraction and then had another with not having his license.. This is a perfect example of the request for new and interesting. Wow instead of being in a car this year you were on a bike. When we ask for new and interesting I think I can speak for everyone by saying hey maybe a DUI this year or a High Risk traffic stop I think that would be new or interesting seeing how it hasnít been done in awhile.

Just because we ask for new and interesting doesnít mean we need to get into the specialized.

The purpose of state comp scenarios should not be so difficult that you need to be an officer to get them(because remember we are NOT officers yet) it should be normal everyday things that an officer may encounter but maybe with a twist.

Think we have posts that cant even master the normal everyday scenarios that we do, how can you expect them to do a specialized scenario?

03-10-2008, 10:19 AM
Actually, Loud Mouth, patrol officers are sometimes called upon to negotiate. Once the Hostage Negotiation Team arrives, if the patrol officer has already established rapport, the team will set up the throw phones and the patrol officer becomes the primary negotiator with the team coaching him/her.