Our Sergeants

It's been noticed that the sergeants of this agency live a very charmed life.

The agency made the position of "lieutenant" to make us look like the bigger agencies and to provide upward mobility. The lieutenants were supposed to free the sergeants from administrative duties and get them on the street. Okay.

Then agency transformed the position of SPO into that of a supervisor. The SPO's handle many of the duties of sergeants and they generally watch officers as they toil, hopelessly understaffed.

The sergeants have been freed up to do whatever it is they do....find DUI's and hand them off to working stiffs? A recent traffic case was lost because of DUI handing off.

Recently, a sergeant was heard to brag that he had nothing to do but collect money.

It's funny that on some nights there are five guys supervising six guys working. You would think with so much supervision that mistakes would be few and quality would be high.......you would be wrong.

It's also been noticed that each sergeant now has an individual office...for what? Fantasy Football?

It's also been noticed that the sergeants and higher ups have gotten some pretty cushy vehicles. The traffic supervisor got a nice truck....why him? Why not a traffic officer? The CIS sergeant grabbed the black SUV from the detectives....why? Does he intend to work and transport bad guys....hahahaha.

It's also been noticed that the OT board is full of wealthy supervisors....why do they need the money so bad? Don't they make enough with their level of pay? Is anyone looking to see if they are all on the up and up? Wouldn't it be classy of them to let the struggling young'uns who get little pay and have the prospect of getting little more in the near future work the details? Wouldn't that help retention which we all know is gonna go kaplooey here soon? How greedy can you get?

How does a person who no longer practices a trade or craft continue to be proficient? The supervisors know alot about policy but if they no longer do police work, how do they continue to learn and become proficient? Would you trust a pilot who hasn't flown a plane himself in years but watched others do it? What happens when the subordinate becomes a better cop? Shouldn't he be in charge? Shouldn't the sergeants take a call or work a case to "Show us how it's done"? Shouldn't they be at the top of their game?

Why can't a supervisor cover calls so a subordinate can eat? Would it kill them? You have so many to choose from on a shift! They eat when they want and they have no consideration for their subordinates. who's looking out for the little guy.

In our eyes, making sergeant is like becoming a made man in the mafia...cash, leisure, rewards, perks and no accountability.

I can't think of a time whena sergeant got in trouble for the failure of a subordinate. We had people stealing and doing god knows what else and not one supervisor was held accountable. Officers are always held accountable but what about those who are supposed to responsible and in charge? What happens when a sergeant fails in a position? Why is he still a sergeant?

Sergeant stripes should be put on with velcro. A sergeant should be a leader and lead by example. A sergeant should be busier, wiser and more skilled than those he leads. When he is not, he should no longer be in charge. Sergeant should not be a birthright, it should be a position that has to be earned more than once.

You really need to get a job somewhere else if your not happy here. No Whining!!

didn't sound whiny....sounded truthy...sarge

I can't imagine how someone with your superior attitude is having difficulty finding happiness here.

Scoop, Sounds dead on, for the most part... We should all be accoutable.

Scoop got a bad eval and is pissed, I don't agree with him, No one is stupid enough to stay at a place where they can't stand their supervisors, except scoop.

Does everyone who makes a point hate it here? Can anyone point things out? Do we always have to smile and say how wonderful things are? Can someone like it here overall and still not like certain aspects?

What if Scoop got an O or E on his/her eval? What if Scoop is a supervisor?

Discredit the messenger, and that makes the message go away.

Scoop,

The bottom line is that your post serves no point but to discredit an entire class of employees at our agency.

Please don't assume to speak for me or others at this agency. I don't agree with all of our Sergeants's all the time nor should I be expected to. However, I have to respect their authority and the obligation that I have to accept their assignments unless they are out of policy or a violation of law.

You took the same oath and follow the same rules so suck it up.

Unfortunatley, even if your post was valid, your credibility is lost with me when you put all supervisors in the same group and write with such negativity that you just come off as a malcontent. Fix that and perhaps people will listen. Fix that at work and perhaps people will listen to your there as well.

Perhaps you make some valid points...I just hear blah blah blah...

I agree with guest, scoop, Im not a supervisor and you don't speak for me at all. Your post was a mark against all supervisors and it's you that has the problem. Sounds like your peers don't agree with you. Don't speak for me !!!

very valid points, scoop! I will agree that a very good amount of sgts are the way you describe. We do have a few who work hard and look out for their officers, but that is few and far between. The system is flawed, but who is listening??

The System is certainly not going to listen to a self appointed sniper who comes on here and blindly strikes out against whole classes of employees at this agency. That is simply terrorist hate speech.

If you want to make an articulate point based on facts, perhaps whe can all discuss it like adults. You want to come on here and be a terrrorist, then I for one will stand up and challenge them. Does the agency have flaws, of course, what agency doesn't. However overall, its a good agency. Scoops post does nothing but destroy the fabric that holds us all together.

We are suppose to be a team and look out for one another. How can he expect to be taken seriously when his posts are meant to piss on 26% of the agency.

TEAM, well......................... Supervisors should lead by example. Scoop had some valid though mute points.

DUI handoffs: If you catch it, you clean it. When you have an abundance of supervisors working their should not be an issue of them working the DUI.

Vehicles: The city is crying for money, but yet we get all these special vehicles. Trucks, colored cars. But yet patrol and others need vehicles.

CIS is driving heaps, Patrol has some to. But we give cars out with no foresight. We have people driving newer cars that have been in more wrecks than 10 year vets.

Yet people fail to understand one thing. Certain members of the command staff are suffering to. They deserve better cars that what their driving.

SPOs: What makes them any different than a patrol officer? They are their to assist the SGT.. I mean gezzzzzzz we have LTs now. We have more than enough supervision. I can understand SGTs not x65ing. But SPOs. You have certain ones that do as much as they can but are limited, you have others that basically state "I’m an SPO, I can't take that or do that call a grunt"


Though these points seem feeble. Many of us just stick these things in the back of our minds and go on. It is understandable that many of these points are misguided and misunderstood.

People fail to realize that the backbone of the agency is patrol and the grunts. Throw us a bone every once and a while. We have a vast majority of officers at our agency that are team players as well as command staff. Not to suck up but, we have received many great things here due to the work of our chief and others. Though it takes time, we do get the tools we need.

Here's some clarification, if you still disagree, then you disagree:

1. I am not a terrorist. I am a sworn law enforcement officer who is not in it for the cash or money. I here here for the public.

2. I guess I should have clarified that I am not calling out all sergeants, we do have many good ones.

3. My purpose was to point out what I perceive to be serious flaws in leadership. I believe people should be lead by example. I believe if you are to reap the benefits of more authority, you should bear the burden of more accountability. I believe that the current system of "Do as I say, not as I do" is completely unacceptable.

4. My pot including facts and a bunch of opinion based on my observations.

5. My purpose was to challenge leaders to be leaders.

6. I normally don't complain or speak out, but I will when I feel the situation warrants it.

7. I am not in trouble, not a malcontent, get good evals etc.....I just want the best for my agency and brothers. I did not name anyone specifically.

8. Just because you don't agree, it doesn't mean I'm wrong.

Quote- "These are the rules. Everybody fights, nobody quits. If you don't do your job I'll kill you myself"

Quote- "I need a corporal. You're it, until you're dead or I find someone better"

Scoop was posting his observations, not speaking for "us." He has a right to do it and we, as well as anyone who has ever put on a uniform, defend it. Grow up and realize that just because someone sees what he/she perceives as a problem does not mean that he is disgruntled. There are plenty of GREAT officers, SPO's, Sgts and above that see when things just aren't right. He/She corrected their post by saying that not all of the supervisors are bad. I can also name some really good things that some of them have done. Take the one with the blue Ford truck....he is constantly trying to "throw a bone" to the patrol guys. He has given two of them, that I can remember, a nice.....REALLY nice radar unit and an ICV system because they were "workers" and earned them! He is also planning to have all of the laser units assigned to patrol officers, permenantly, who demonstrate a desire to enforce speed violations. No more going to the arms room to find they are all sitting in the trunk of someones cruiser.

Scoop has some very valid points and I respect his right to post them!

Scoop would have never made it in the military, he would have been crying cause a Sgt. has a new tank. Get a life! I have no respect for anyone like you. You are a disgrace to your badge and a whining rat. No, I'm not a boss, but nothing is lower than a whiner who can't get a job elswhere and complains. A sneak who will say "Hello" to bosses in the hallway and then whine "Mommy, Johnny has a new car" , what a baby. We didn't put up with jerks like you in the military.

well your a bright bulb. PPPD is not the military, although we are paramilitary in nature. Maybe scoop would not make it in the service, but whats the point? The post says people can have opinions and gripes about certain issues, but still thinks his/her work place is a good situation to be in. I can't stand people who come on this site and bash others for bringing up items that they see are wrong or could be corrected. I know what you are thinking... "Go tell your supervisor" or "grow some balls and tell them to their face". Right, a real great career move for most, but effective for a limited few. Ok, now look at the new vehicles. Why do the supervisors and admin need brand spanking new before before others driving old junkers? Why did training get 2 new truck/SUV type vehicles decked out with all the bells and whistles? When is the last time they copied calls or responded to an on-call situation?? We worry about keeping the PD vehicles looking nice, but how many times can you run a junk pile through Laredo to see it needs to go to the heep yard? I agree rank has it's priviledges, but enough is enough. We have more supervisors than we need. We should just assign a supervisor to drive with each officer, every shift, each night. Better yet lets make a new rank of Colonel and promote a few more. This is a great place to work in some ways, but in others the good old boys system is in full effect. Stop promoting, helping, or protecting your buddies. It may seem like a good thing to do, but people are watching. Remember the officers have the ear of the city folks they encounter. Sooner or later these issues will make it to a city councel meeting and someone will be held accountable for the actions. I like the chief, but I don't think she knows everything that is going on under her nose. Time to pull back and regroup.

I agree with some views PPPD SCOOP has but I hope your not my 94 on calls. SCOOP is for sure a grunt like me on Patrol and is the first one to "snitch" on another officer. I'm out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Scoop....I have gained some respect for you after your follow up post and appreciate the others who have posted accurate articulate facts on this subject.

I am not sure we can agree on everything, such as, I don't believe this is the correct forum to air our dirty laundry complaints but we share some common ground.

However, no matter what rank in any organization you talk about, you have variety of personalities, work ethics, etc. That is what makes us all unique. Some are better than others. I would venture a guess that not every Sergeant works out the way admin expected, not every SPO works out like anticipated, and we all know many officers who haven't been able to cut it despite someones perception at some point that they would. Some officers make better zone partners than others, some officers get along better with this officer than that one. Some officers will take your call for you on your Friday and others won't.

My complaint with your issue is that I think that is the same in any organization and in any job class. This problem is not specific to PPPD. But, challenging a leader to lead by example is not a bad thing. There are some that probably could use the reminder. However, we have some that do just that. Your initial post cast all into the same pot and I have many that I have worked for that do not fall into that classification. So, I appreciate your clarification.

Now to address my brother HUH?...

I agree with alot of what you said but need to spar over a couple of your points....

DUI handoffs.... Since when and in what job have you every worked where your boss couldn't assign you work to do? If my Sergeant wants to hand me a DUI (an assignment to do) I do it. That is my job and I will do it to the best of my ability because that is what a professional does. We have an unwritten rule that we want our K-9's and supervisors x8 in the city as much as possible for what should be obvious reasons.

It has been my experience that supervisers hand off DUI's to officers who either want to take them because they enjoy working them or to officers who need to take them because they need the practice. Either way, it is their decision to make.

Some in CIS are driving heaps....However others in CIS are driving some of the nicest vehicles in the fleet. CIS wanted a variety of vehicles in the fleet for U/C purposes and the admin and city agreed. I am fairly confident that those vehicles will be replaced as soon as they can be.

As for the truck and colored cars....Colored Cars? Last time I checked, white was a color. I don't think the cost for different colored cars was a cost increase. If it was, it couldn't have been much...I have heard that a brand new Ford truck is being striped and outfitted as a cruiser and will be assigned to patrol. All the SUV's and trucks are part of a plan to be able to utilize certain vehicles from our fleet in flood response situtations if necessary. If you recall our recent past, it would have been helpful. It certainly beats us driving around in city dump trucks. That is why the city has spent the extra money on the trucks....They have a higher clearance in water and our cruisers swamp easily.

Your other points are valid...

Good debate though...

low life, stop complaining about who drives what cars, you did that at Christmas when your brother got a shiny truck and you didn't. It didn't work with mommy & daddy and it won't work here. Grow some courage, or better yet if you are of age do a stint in the military! Grow some!!

Sorry angry person, but my vehicle is in fantastic shape. Sorry you get upset about someone pointing out the obvious. Please take advantage of the EAP plan the city offers, you seem to need a hug or some mental health evaluation for anger management issues. Remember this site was designed to air issues that many feel they cannot at work. Just because you become an officer does not mean they remove the part of your brain that has differing opinions. If you stick to a topic and keep it clean and safe, there should be no problem with heathly debates or differences in opinions.

Let's look at some facts shall we...

C1 is still driving an 8 year old Chevy Lumina
C2 is driving a 7 year old Chevy Impala
C3 doesn't have an assigned car and takes whatever he can scrap up. Until recently...he was driving a 9 year old Dodge Intrepid but the garage made us surplus it because it was crap.
C4 has a new vehicle that can pull horse trailers and other equipment used for the mounted unit. But then again he volunteers all of his time to the mounted unit training but I'm sure you knew that.

Now lets talk about training. How would you think it best to carry thousands of rounds of ammunition to and from training sessions? Yugo? I bet a better answer would be by SUV and truck. Call me crazy but it makes a little sense. Now lets talk about timing. One vehicle was a replacement for a training car that was totaled in a car crash that knocked the officer out of work for 5 months and nearly cost her, her career. The other was a replacement for a 13 year old car that had been handed down from admin to CIS to training. Sounds a little like new vehicles were necessary wouldn't you say?

It's amazing what you can learn when you ask a few people in the know some questions.

The reason some of the cars are a little older than some would like is because of our take home program. Older cars had to be kept in order for everyone to have a car because the take home program had to be phased in over a number of years. Slowly those older cars are being phased out and newer ones purchased.

Cynical plan to keep patrol officers down or logical sequence of events.... You decide.

Thanks for the update Lon, way to tell everyone in cyberland who is driving what.

5 months? She hasn't worked a full day in years.

I don't think vehicles were the focus of scoop's post. I think he was trying to point out that we have too many chiefs and not enough indians and also people shouldn't ask of others things they are not prepared to do themselves.

"Colored Cars??" There goes the neighborhood!

SHUT UP PPPD SCOOP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We know who you are......

Your number is no lower than 430 and no higher than for 439.......

HHHHmmmmmmmmmmmmm who is PPPD SCOOP??????

I'm guessing SMITHERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WATCH THIS POSTING TO SEE IF IT IS DELEATED !!!

I think we are forgetting the original post's idea... The problem here is that there are too many Sgt's and SPO's on the road during a shift... When you have minimum staffing on the road you should not be looking at SPO's and Sgt's to assist with the call load or even better - as your number of Officers working. It doesn't happen... plain and simply. Anyone that says it does is either an SPO or Sgt. Yea I know they take back up's every once in awhile....BUTTTT??? Enough is Enough!!!

[MOD 1]

WATCH THIS POSTING TO SEE IF IT IS DELEATED !!!

I think we are forgetting the original post's idea... The problem here is that there are too many Sgt's and SPO's on the road during a shift... When you have minimum staffing on the road you should not be looking at SPO's and Sgt's to assist with the call load or even better - as your number of Officers working. It doesn't happen... plain and simply. Anyone that says it does is either an SPO or Sgt. Yea I know they take back up's every once in awhile....BUTTTT??? Enough is Enough!!!

Why would you think this post might get deleted? It doesn't violate the Terms of Use.

Mod 1